Andy Pastuszak
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Post by Andy Pastuszak on Dec 5, 2022 4:08:34 GMT
I'm thinking in the style of the 1976 bicentennial souvenir sheets, where there would be stamps embedded in the sheet for the Baby Jesus, Mary, Joseph. Wise Men, Shepherds, etc. I think that would sell well for them.
The same could be done for Hanukah. Make a menorah souvenir sheet with each candle a stamp.
A contemporary "santa's workshop" sheet would also go over well.
Opinions?
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jdtrue66
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What I collect: US&US FDC, Keys & Locks, NUDES, Rubber Ducks, USS NJ covers
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Post by jdtrue66 on Dec 5, 2022 14:58:46 GMT
I don't know if they would for the political backlash. Just in stamps this year you have religious and non religious Christmas. That alone gets hate mail from (or really hate emails) from separation from church and state people and the keep Christ in Christmas people. Then you have 2 Kwanzaa & Hanukkah 1 Diwali & Eid Greetings. Past that you need just winter this year flowers and otters with snowballs. I am sure some people are still not happy.
Add to that on the environment people screaming about the waste and killing the planet for all the extra paper in a souvenir sheet.
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angore
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Post by angore on Dec 5, 2022 18:56:23 GMT
I was waiting for stamps on vintage wrapping paper designs!
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Philatarium
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Los Angeles, CA
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Post by Philatarium on Dec 6, 2022 4:45:38 GMT
I was waiting for stamps on vintage wrapping paper designs! That's a great idea!!
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Andy Pastuszak
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Post by Andy Pastuszak on Dec 6, 2022 14:21:20 GMT
How much backlash did the USPS get for their 2015 and 2016 stamps? I quite liked the design.
The USPS prints things as needed, or they should. I know at one point they discontinued the Eid and Hanukah stamps because Muslims and Jews don't send each other cards on this holidays, the way Christians, and people that celebrate secular Christmas send Christmas cards. They would print stamps and no one would buy them.
I really don't buy into the whole "separation of Church and State" thing when it comes to images on postage stamps. Print what sells. No reason not to make stamps for a time of year when mail volume is higher than it is any other time of the year.
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jdtrue66
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What I collect: US&US FDC, Keys & Locks, NUDES, Rubber Ducks, USS NJ covers
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Post by jdtrue66 on Dec 7, 2022 2:50:34 GMT
There are lawsuits and from friends that work for the postal inspectors office lots of hate. No the other religions do not sell as well but if you represent more religions you can sell the ones that do.
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angore
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Post by angore on Dec 7, 2022 10:56:45 GMT
Given there are Forever stamps, I do not think they need to issue holiday or other themed stamps like Love stamps every year since they have generic designs. For example, a person does not get married every year so not likely to be concerned with using the same stamps again on their invitations. They should focus more covering US history and less on more recent pop culture.
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jdtrue66
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What I collect: US&US FDC, Keys & Locks, NUDES, Rubber Ducks, USS NJ covers
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Post by jdtrue66 on Dec 9, 2022 5:22:52 GMT
The love stamps are good sellers not just for VD day but for weddings engagements I think the numbers show what sells:
In Millions
Love 150 Holiday Elves 600 Hanukkah 12 Kwanzaa 12 Virgin and Child 200 US Flags 1,500 Nancy Regan 18 Go Beyond 45 School Bus 100 Women Rowing 18
So the ranks by number printed is Flag, Non Religious Christmas, Religious Christmas, Love, School Bus, and the rest are way under that 45 to 12 million
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Andy Pastuszak
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Praying for my family and everyone in Ukraine.
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Post by Andy Pastuszak on Dec 9, 2022 23:32:39 GMT
The love stamps are good sellers not just for VD day but for weddings engagements I think the numbers show what sells: In Millions Love 150 Holiday Elves 600 Hanukkah 12 Kwanzaa 12 Virgin and Child 200 US Flags 1,500 Nancy Regan 18 Go Beyond 45 School Bus 100 Women Rowing 18 So the ranks by number printed is Flag, Non Religious Christmas, Religious Christmas, Love, School Bus, and the rest are way under that 45 to 12 million I don't know if they're still doing it, but for a while there were Love stamps and Wedding stamps issued in the same year.
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Andy Pastuszak
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Praying for my family and everyone in Ukraine.
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Post by Andy Pastuszak on Dec 9, 2022 23:42:30 GMT
Given there are Forever stamps, I do not think they need to issue holiday or other themed stamps like Love stamps every year since they have generic designs. For example, a person does not get married every year so not likely to be concerned with using the same stamps again on their invitations. They should focus more covering US history and less on more recent pop culture. I remember one year the USPS did not issue a traditional Christmas stamp because they had tons of Madonna and Child stamps left over from the previous year. And a lot of conservative Christian groups went a little ape**** claiming the USPS is dropping the religious Christmas stamp and wanted people to write their congressperson and the Postmaster General demanding the return of the traditional Christmas stamp.
When the USPS pointed out that last year's leftover stamps were on-sale this year, then conservative Christian groups felt snubbed because they felt the USPS was blowing them off by not making a new design.
It's really a no-win situation for the USPS. If they make a religious stamp, people will scream about the separation of Church and State. And if they don't make a religious stamp, then Bible thumpers will scream about it.
I remember asking some close Jewish friends about the Hanukkah stamps. And they all told me Jews don't send Hanukkah cards. There is no need for a Hanukkah stamp.
Honestly I think sometimes people get outraged on someone else's behalf.
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jdtrue66
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What I collect: US&US FDC, Keys & Locks, NUDES, Rubber Ducks, USS NJ covers
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Post by jdtrue66 on Dec 10, 2022 2:45:18 GMT
Right now they are not doing both but love and the flowers that lots of people will use for weddings. 12 Million Hanukkah is not a big number for a stamp just collectors will buy a bulk of them. But it is still a catch 22 if you don't include the other religions it seems they are decriminalizing. If they don't do them they lose the 3 largest seller.
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swvl
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What I collect: FDCs, plus some US modern and new issues. Topical interests include music, art, literature, baseball, space...
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Post by swvl on Dec 10, 2022 2:47:13 GMT
I remember asking some close Jewish friends about the Hanukkah stamps. And they all told me Jews don't send Hanukkah cards. There is no need for a Hanukkah stamp.
Honestly I think sometimes people get outraged on someone else's behalf.
Andy, I know you’re just thinking out loud and you mean no harm here. But I have to say I don’t agree with your conclusion ("There is no need for a Hanukkah stamp."). Yeah, Hanukkah stamps don’t sell as well as Christmas ones — there are a lot fewer Jews in this country than there are people who celebrate Christmas. But not everything is about numbers. It means a lot to me as a Jewish stamp collector to be able to buy Hanukkah stamps every couple of years. It made me really happy to see this year’s stamps. They're beautifully designed, I used them to make FDCs and to send letters to friends and family. They tell people like me that we’re included, that we’re part of America. What message would it send if USPS followed your advice and stopped printing them? Again, I know you mean well. But I had to say something.
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jdtrue66
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What I collect: US&US FDC, Keys & Locks, NUDES, Rubber Ducks, USS NJ covers
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Post by jdtrue66 on Dec 10, 2022 2:58:09 GMT
swvl I do agree most of the Hanukkah stamps are beautiful.
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Andy Pastuszak
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Post by Andy Pastuszak on Dec 10, 2022 3:00:52 GMT
I remember asking some close Jewish friends about the Hanukkah stamps. And they all told me Jews don't send Hanukkah cards. There is no need for a Hanukkah stamp.
Honestly I think sometimes people get outraged on someone else's behalf.
Andy, I know you’re just thinking out loud and you mean no harm here. But I have to say I don’t agree with your conclusion. Yeah, Hanukkah stamps don’t sell as well as Christmas ones — there are a lot fewer Jews in this country than there are people who celebrate Christmas. But not everything is about numbers. It means a lot to me as a Jewish stamp collector to be able to buy Hanukkah stamps every couple of years. It made me really happy to see this year’s stamps. They're beautifully designed, I used them to make FDCs and to send letters to friends and family. They tell people like me that we’re included, that we’re part of America. What message would it send if USPS followed your advice and stopped printing them? Again, I know you mean well. But I had to say something. I have no issue with Hanukah stamps. Heck, I'd love to see a Souvenir sheet that has a stamp for every major Jewish holiday with a description on the back. Honestly, it's a question of volume. I grew up in a VERY Jewish neighborhood. I was very close friends with 2 Hassidic Jewish families across the street from my house. I still talk to those families all the time. And they tell me they have zero interest in a Hanukah stamp. Admittedly, my exposure is to about 2 dozen Jewish people, and they're Hassidic. So, they're not exactly a representative sample of Jewish people across the country.
My issue isn't the existence of the stamps. It's USPS expectations. It seems to me that they print way more stamps than they need to and get stuck with leftovers. The real question is, can they pay to have a stamp designed, print it in sufficient quantities that they sell through what they have, and at least break even?
But i know the USPS has said it the past that Hanukah and Eid stamps just don't sell. I don't know exactly what the means. Does it mean they lose money on the stamps or does it mean that the stamps don't sell as well as they hoped they would.
I don't mean to offend anyone. I'm just looking at things practically. The USPS needs to at least break even on the designs they issue. That doesn't even happen on some of their regular commemorative stamps. Heck, we all know the story of the Simpsons stamps.
I have a petty interesting story about my neighbors that I would love to share. Feel free to PM me.
The USPS has a habit of overprinting everything.
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swvl
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Post by swvl on Dec 10, 2022 3:04:02 GMT
OK, that's fair Andy Pastuszak and thanks for clarifying what you meant. I would like to see a souvenir sheet like that too! In the meantime... I'll keep buying Hanukkah stamps when they issue them.
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eggdog
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Post by eggdog on Dec 10, 2022 4:34:03 GMT
Secular Christmas stamps have outnumbered the religious ones by about 15 to 1 on mail received here in the last several years. There are a couple of religiously-themed Christmas stamps that I never even saw. And our friends and families aren't exceptionally secular as a group. The USPS needs to at least break even on the designs they issue. That doesn't even happen on some of their regular commemorative stamps. Heck, we all know the story of the Simpsons stamps. I didn't take the time to look it up, but I remember from years ago that the Simpsons stamps were a very strange affair. The USPS sold so many of them that they ordered a second printing. And sales stopped almost immediately. It wasn't the stamps that were unpopular, it was that the USPS got it spot-on the first time and didn't know it. I don't get enough mail with commemoratives on the envelopes to make this anywhere near statistically valid, but stamps with historical events and people from American political history - the bread and butter of the stanp program from the Colombus and Trans-Mississippi series through all the Bicentennial overissuing and into the 1980s - never show up in our mail. I got tons of those Disney and Bugs Bunny stamps, the superheroes, even Hot Wheels (which I barely knew existed, ever) and a couple of Harry Potters. The only historically-oriented stamps I remember being at all popular in the last ±20 years were the 50-state-plus-a-few-territories flag coils. I went through sheets of the 39¢ Benjamin Franklin stamps from 2006 because I liked them so much, and I think the only copies I have are on a couple of letters that got returned to me. Put Peanuts on stamps, and I'd probably have 30 of them. (And I'm so sick of Peanuts I can have nihilistic thoughts all day just from seeing one of those kids. The first 300 times around were fine for those moldy old gags, thank you very much.) They did use a quote from John Adams on postmarks for a few months, in the days when postmarks were so ugly you couldn't read them and probably avoided even looking at them anyway, but you'll probably never see him on a stamp ever again because nobody would buy it. Except me. Short, portly New Englanders with bad hair and irascible temperaments, we gotta stand up for each other. I understand and respect that a lot of people wouldn't want to have slaveholders on their stamps. But political or moral beliefs aside, I don't think the traditional historical topics cut much ice with the buying public these days, no matter what good (or bad) in our history they represent. I do appreciate that the USPS has featured many incredibly good American artists in recent years. I wish they'd do another series of incredibly good American musicians and composers, preferably with designs that aren't comic book covers like those 80s and 90s ones were, but I know they wouldn't be popular. (What ever happened to that one-a-year series with Ray Charles, Elvis, Lydia "Who?" Mendoza, Hendrix, Janis, etc. Was that quietly cancelled? We need another John Coltrane stamp, and I wouldn't mind a couple of peeps like Perry Como, either. Tony Bennett, absolutely. Sister Rosetta Tharpe, just get it done already!) Basically, I'd like it if there were more Christian-themed Christmas stamps, and I think they should have some American folk art or modern Christian art. And yeah, I'm all in favor of Hanukkah and Eid and all the others, too, and I sometimes use them on seasonal greetings. And I do like @apastuzak's ideas for Christmas and Hanukkah. I'd buy 'em.
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angore
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Post by angore on Dec 10, 2022 11:05:41 GMT
Andy Do you want a supersize Nativity scene then have stamps defined on certain areas similar to the US Nature of American series? Or, make it an advent like calendar using Christian elements, one could have a star, the wise men, the shepherds, Jewish family, little drummer boy, animals.....
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angore
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Post by angore on Dec 10, 2022 12:44:13 GMT
There have been folk art issues. I just want less pop culture (super heros, movie characters like Harry Potter, etc).
If they issues more Christian specific art they would be forced to add more other non-Christian religious art.
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jdtrue66
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What I collect: US&US FDC, Keys & Locks, NUDES, Rubber Ducks, USS NJ covers
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Post by jdtrue66 on Dec 10, 2022 14:18:38 GMT
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Andy Pastuszak
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Post by Andy Pastuszak on Dec 10, 2022 14:57:25 GMT
Andy Do you want a supersize Nativity scene then have stamps defined on certain areas similar to the US Nature of American series? Or, make it an advent like calendar using Christian elements, one could have a star, the wise men, the shepherds, Jewish family, little drummer boy, animals..... That's exactly what I am thinking. And it does not need to be limited to just the religious Christmas stamps. You could do a sheet for "Santa's Workshop," or a scene from a Ranin-Bass Christmas special. Kids would BEG their parents to buy sheets like that. I'd love to see a sheet of "Christmas Traditions Around The World" stamps, that shows various Christmas tree styles, yule logs, and other things around the world that other cultures do on Christmas. I feel like any stamp that USPS issues for a non-secular holiday, should come on a small souvenir sheet, with a block of 4 stamps on the left or right and a paragraph or two of descriptive text around off to the side. This could include Kwanzaa, Eid, Hanukah, Diwali, or any holiday. Ukraine does these series of stamps called "National Minorities of Ukraine." They have four stamps for each minority. So far they have done: 1. Crimean Tatars 2. Jews 3 Roma 4. Greeks I wish those stamps came on souvenir sheets with descriptive texts. I asked my father once about how minorities are treated in Western Ukraine where he grew up. He said the largest minority group he interacted with was the Jews. He said Ukrainian tailors HATE Jews. Jews are known for being such good tailors, if a Jewish tailor moves into a town, he can quite literally put all the Ukrainian tailors out of business in a few weeks in a pretty big area, because everyone wants to go to the Jewish tailor. And he said back in the 1920s-30s, you didn't throw anything away. If pot or pan or other kitchen utensil broke, you saved it and when the Roma came through, there's be a huge line for them to fix stuff. No one would even dream of letting anybody other than the Roma fix their stuff because they wanted it "done right."
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swvl
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Post by swvl on Dec 10, 2022 14:58:15 GMT
eggdog, that American musicians series started about 10 years ago is still going. This year they issued a Pete Seeger stamp that I liked a lot. But I definitely would like to see more musicians on US stamps. John Coltrane, yes! How about Alice Coltrane too? Or Ornette Coleman? (Sorry, we’re getting off topic here!)
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Andy Pastuszak
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Post by Andy Pastuszak on Dec 10, 2022 15:01:14 GMT
There have been folk art issues. I just want less pop culture (super heros, movie characters like Harry Potter, etc). If they issues more Christian specific art they would be forced to add more other non-Christian religious art. Sadly, pop-culture sells. Even if the USPS makes stamps that might appeal to a certain group, they need to market to that group, which I don't think they do effectively. We all know about new USPS stamps coming out. But my wife and kids have no clue. Every day I get an "Informed Delivery" email telling me what mail I am getting that day. You'd think they could add stamp announcements to that email.
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