stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jun 27, 2020 0:24:48 GMT
Pont du Gard- I am almost pulling my hair out trying to see the actual difference between different Types. Information is somewhat conflicting, thin paper/thick paper/opaque paper/transparent paper... when a size is called- one place seems to be outside dimensions of the stamp, while others seem to be the image- perforations 13, 11 and 13 1/2... 11 is easy enough, but I seem to get 13 - 1/4....( ) Shading inside the "first full arch on left , middle tier" shading horizontal line, diagonal... I've looked at multiple images online of supposedly different Types and they look about the same to me (and no where can I find any clear detail, Maury, Ceres & Dallay has two small images with arrows... but I cannot really see a big difference)) aside from perforation, this is seeming rather subjective so - two stamps below, same type, just a color variation or different? I'm beginning to think these are the same and the latter issue you be the judge (and thanks for your opinion!!!)
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Beryllium Guy
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What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Jun 27, 2020 7:54:07 GMT
Hi, Stan ( stainlessb)! I have no particular expertise in this area, and I think that spotting color varieties is one of the most subjective and difficult things to do in our hobby, which is why I normally try not to spend too much time on it! Too much hair-pulling, as you mention! That said, to my eye based on the scans, it seems to me that the second stamp has a slight reddish hue to it, compared to the first. I don't know if that is reality, or potentially inherent in the scan or my display settings or anything else, but that's how it looks to me. Very similar colors, close enough to be considered the same, but also potentially varieties. Maddening, isn't it? As for identifying the design variety, I have no idea. Xavier ( hrdoktorx) uses Y&T catalogues and is quite knowledgeable about France, and of course, anglobob is also a France and colonies collector. Ryan and Jon ( blaamand) are also good detectives on details. Perhaps one of them can help. In any case, nice stamps!
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jun 27, 2020 14:08:23 GMT
The colors are slightly different shades as you noticed. And if these were the same Type I might well keep both because of the color nuance. I just bought another this morning described simply as Yvert #262... no Type, which seems the issue with manyI see offered
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jun 27, 2020 19:21:59 GMT
Here are close ups of the "1st complete arch on left, middle tier", using my Unitron scope to take these These appear to be the same Type, but is the shading "they" refer to as horizontal... or diagonal... well i kind of see both in the darker area of the arch....
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renden
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Post by renden on Jun 27, 2020 22:09:06 GMT
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hrdoktorx
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What I collect: France (and French territories), Africa, Canada, USA, Germany, Guatemala, stamps about science, flags, maps, stamps on stamps...
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Post by hrdoktorx on Jul 2, 2020 15:58:45 GMT
I get conflicting information from my catalogs: Cérès 1996 and my Michel 2004: #262 - perf. 13, transparent paper, types IIA and IIB #262A - perf. 13 1/2, opaque paper, type I #262B - perf. 11, white paper, type I While my older 1938 Y&T catalog has the perforation as 14x13 1/2 for YT#262. Type I has the shading in the second arch of the middle row done with horizontal lines. Type IIA and IIB have three oblique lines cutting the horizontal lines. The difference between IIA and IIB is the presence, in type IIB, of the white little rectangle (visible in both your stamps), to the left of the third frame rectangle (counting from the top) on the right side of the stamp, which widens its edge partially. Type IIA and IIB both exist in two colours ("chaudron" and "chaudron clair"), where I would translate "chaudron" as a copperish brown. It's tricky to judge colour differences from separate scans, so I will not speculate there, but your stamps look like Type IIB to me, both.
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Aug 7, 2020 23:39:00 GMT
Received the top stamp today- only one left to go (and of course the most $$), . Even slow progress is progress!
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hrdoktorx
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What I collect: France (and French territories), Africa, Canada, USA, Germany, Guatemala, stamps about science, flags, maps, stamps on stamps...
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Post by hrdoktorx on Sept 21, 2020 20:32:12 GMT
Received today, three French classics: From left to right: - YT#39C, "Bordeaux issue", 1c olive green, type II: shading under the eyes made of lines and a white contour line at the back of the head - YT#60B, Type III, 25c blue, recognizable at the blue dots in the top frieze corners inside the white petals. - YT#36, Siege of Paris issue, 10c, bistre yellow
As it sometimes happens when ordering online and working across catalogs, #60B was not the Type II that I expected, so it's a duplicate for me that is up for trade if someone's interested.
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chrischross
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What I collect: France, French Africa, FSAT, French Polynesia
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Post by chrischross on Sept 23, 2020 22:46:24 GMT
Received today, three French classics: From left to right: - YT#39C, "Bordeaux issue", 1c olive green, type II: shading under the eyes made of lines and a white contour line at the back of the head - YT#60B, Type III, 25c blue, recognizable at the blue dots in the top frieze corners inside the white petals. - YT#36, Siege of Paris issue, 10c, bistre yellow
For me, a YT #4 and the rest a series of YT #60c: Always excellent to get a spot on the first page of the album filled in. It's pretty lonely on that page From my reading of the Yvert, isn't 60b Type II, and 60c Type III? Or do the types go across 60, 60b, 60c? I really need to get my French up to speed.
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Sept 23, 2020 23:20:08 GMT
There are three types for # 60 (#58 Scott), and it all has to do with the corner rosettes, especially the top right on Type I - box and petals fully intact Type II - (the least common) the left inside border of top right corner rosette was has a small break in it Type III - the petals have been eaten by bugs (small holes/breaks in the petals/blades) I only a handful of Type II... and it took me a while to find, which is why I purchased so many lots, but I have enough now when I do tackle this series for pages I will be devoting space to numerical cancellations! below is one of several Vario pages
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renden
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Post by renden on Sept 23, 2020 23:31:35 GMT
Now let's see a member present hhis Types - Great show guys !!
René p.s. please use same Catalog - I would use Maury but Y&T is good !!
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chrischross
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What I collect: France, French Africa, FSAT, French Polynesia
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Post by chrischross on Sept 24, 2020 0:05:59 GMT
Thanks stainlessb -- I think I understand the differences between I, II, III, but what's not clear in the Yvert is the difference between 60a, 60b, 60c. Why did I jettison my Scott Classic as a comparison resource? The way my non-specialized Yvert reads, it indicates: 60a 25c bleu (I), 60b 25c bleu (II), 60c 25c bleu (III). There just doesn't seem to be any color nuance between a, b, c either. I'm pretty used to the Bordeaux series, thus the confusion, as everything in Bordeaux is broken down by Type and Report and then color nuance (a, b, c, etc.).
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Sept 24, 2020 0:30:33 GMT
I you are interested in shades/nuances I recommend Maury Ceres & Dallay or Spink | Maury- they seem to go into much more "detail"
M C & D lists a total of 14 different nuances between the 3 types, with Type II having the greater CV ( 5 shades)
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chrischross
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What I collect: France, French Africa, FSAT, French Polynesia
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Post by chrischross on Sept 24, 2020 1:04:13 GMT
I you are interested in shades/nuances I recommend Maury Ceres & Dallay or Spink | Maury- they seem to go into much more "detail" M C & D lists a total of 14 different nuances between the 3 types, with Type II having the greater CV ( 5 shades) I see my confusion -- and this has nothing to do with color nuance, it's a quirk of Yvert. 60A = Type I, 60B = Type II, 60C = Type III. I will definitely need to get ahold of something more detailed than the Yvert, but for now, it's sufficient. Thanks to your post I see what I'm calling the "break in the frame" in the upper right hand corner, rather than Yvert's "Point de couleur à gauche du fleuron" for 60B, Type II. It's pretty obvious.
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hrdoktorx
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What I collect: France (and French territories), Africa, Canada, USA, Germany, Guatemala, stamps about science, flags, maps, stamps on stamps...
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Post by hrdoktorx on Sept 24, 2020 5:49:27 GMT
I you are interested in shades/nuances I recommend Maury Ceres & Dallay or Spink | Maury- they seem to go into much more "detail" M C & D lists a total of 14 different nuances between the 3 types, with Type II having the greater CV ( 5 shades) I see my confusion -- and this has nothing to do with color nuance, it's a quirk of Yvert. 60A = Type I, 60B = Type II, 60C = Type III. I will definitely need to get ahold of something more detailed than the Yvert, but for now, it's sufficient. Thanks to your post I see what I'm calling the "break in the frame" in the upper right hand corner, rather than Yvert's "Point de couleur à gauche du fleuron" for 60B, Type II. It's pretty obvious. Indeed, I added to the confusion (and to mine) because I ordered these stamps from the YT website, but am using myself a Cérès catalog for early France. Although they do state in the preamble that their numbering is the same as Yvert's, this, it turns out, is only true for the main numbers, i.e. #60 refers to the same 25c blue issue, but the sub-ordering of the varieties is not consistent. Cérès lists the three main types as 60I, 60II, 60III, while Yvert uses 60A to 60C, but not in the same order, apparently!
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Nov 23, 2020 23:15:27 GMT
France 1938 Semi-postal Completion of the reconstruction of Reims Cathedral Sc# B74 anyone have any idea what the diagonal stamp may be?
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chrischross
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What I collect: France, French Africa, FSAT, French Polynesia
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Post by chrischross on Dec 1, 2020 9:08:12 GMT
The CNEP, the French analogue to our ASDA has a very informative Twitter feed: twitter.com/CNEP75I'm watching a YouTube they posted with Alain Jacquart, philatelic expert on French classics (pre-1900) for 40 years, who expertise's for Calves, has a fascinating presentation on forgeries of the YT 18: I don't want to spoil the findings here of how fake YT 18s are manufactured, as its pretty fascinating stuff. The other thing to look out for is the substitution of the Reimpression of 1862 (YT 18d, cheaper catalog value) sold as the original 1853 issue. I'm not a native French speaker by any means, but even I can follow along (years of reading French stamp catalogs :-)). There are subtitles in French, so you can always type those into Google Translate for the translation.
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Dec 19, 2020 0:47:59 GMT
France 1929 Mont St. Michel 5 F Yvert 260 Type II with Paire Surcharge (type II ?) Does anyone know anything about these? I find very little information (and I realize these may be forged overprints
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hrdoktorx
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What I collect: France (and French territories), Africa, Canada, USA, Germany, Guatemala, stamps about science, flags, maps, stamps on stamps...
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Post by hrdoktorx on Dec 19, 2020 9:00:00 GMT
Stamps bearing that overprint, which means "Occupied area - North France" were issued in 1940 by the invading German forces. They were used mostly in the Dunkirk area. The overprint exists in two types, Type I with rounded corners and Type II with straight corners. The fact that the stamp on the left on your scan bears a Paris postmark is a strong indicator that it may be a forgery. Paris was never part of the area where those stamps were used.
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Dec 28, 2020 23:11:22 GMT
a small lot of precancels received today- I was attracted to the lot for the 7 1/2 c Type Blanc. issued 1926, Yvert # PREO 42, Bottom row #3) not commonly seen, I have only one other and it is un-gummed, and this one was MNH. Also, something I didn't notice when I bid on them the 20 c Semeuse Camée has what I belive qualifies as "anneau lune" which as I understand printing defects where a small un-inked dot ( sometimes with a halo) appears in the background- Look under the back hand and also under the 0 (in 20c). This stamp in general had dust/dirt on the plate or paper as the backgrounds are typically very solid and the "anneau lune" are not very common. The image/Sower herself is well defined
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Dec 29, 2020 20:37:49 GMT
Instead of the DIY thread, I thought this would be more appropriate- 1924 -1925 commemoratives. I must do something about the Pierre de Ronsard stamp....
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jan 5, 2021 15:08:02 GMT
1924 Yvert 184 (?) The Trophy a printers error? a trial? changeling... I don't think so, the frame is as it should be, although a slighlty different shade of red. There is one listed color variety in both Maury and Spinks "couleur rose unicolore" which seems an unusual description compared to most color descriptions and Google Translates returns "solid pink" .... What do you think?
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brightonpete
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Post by brightonpete on Jan 5, 2021 15:34:07 GMT
And Scott's says it is rose and dark rose! That looks more like a reddish brown and brownish yellow to me...
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jan 5, 2021 17:40:10 GMT
I'm not really sure what to make of it, but I liked it enough to make an offer which he accepted.
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jan 6, 2021 1:22:12 GMT
received today France 1876 Sage 10c Type II # 76 a nice dark green
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jan 8, 2021 21:21:11 GMT
1933 commemoratives, Yvert # 290 - 293
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jan 15, 2021 23:26:25 GMT
Type Blanc, Yvert 111 Type IA 5 centimes, fairly worn, but the cancellation?!? Anyone know anything about this? Ihave 2 references on France obliteration but they cut-off prior to 1900- This stamp was in use Dec 12, 1900 until June , 1902 (or whenever the excess was used up)
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Beryllium Guy
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Jan 16, 2021 0:07:24 GMT
Type Blanc, Yvert 111 Type IA 5 centimes, fairly worn, but the cancellation?!? Anyone know anything about this? I have 2 references on France obliteration but they cut-off prior to 1900- This stamp was in use Dec 12, 1900 until June , 1902 (or whenever the excess was used up) Interesting post, Stan! I don't know the answer to your question (wish I did!), but let's tag some of the members who might have a better idea: Xavier ( hrdoktorx) and Bob ( anglobob) first come to mind. Perhaps Ryan, who is also often a great source of knowledge, may also be able to help. Hopefully, someone will be able to tell us more about your cancellation.
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anglobob
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What I collect: France and French Colonies,French cinderellas British Commonwealth QE2
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Post by anglobob on Jan 16, 2021 3:30:43 GMT
I have not seen this cancellation before on any of my French stamps.I showed it a friend here and he thinks it is possibly a Spanish cancel.I looked in my Maury catalogue and there is a cancel called cachet espagnol.However,this has smaller number 2,s around the edge of a circle,as well as the 2 in the centre.Maybe it is some sort of private or internal cancellation ,maybe a bank or similar institution ?
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stainlessb
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Post by stainlessb on Jan 16, 2021 3:41:17 GMT
Cool! I I love a good mystery!!!
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