Londonbus1
Moderator 
Cinderella Stamp Club Member 3059
Posts: 4,884 
What I collect: Cinderellas and some Ephemera from Great Britain, France and Israel plus a few beautiful bits from elsewhere !! Topical interests include Flags & Judaica, the latter with an emphasis on the Jewish National Fund.
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Post by Londonbus1 on Aug 24, 2023 12:47:00 GMT
It's been coming for years, but somehow I didn't want to believe it. Not that it had a huge effect on my collecting. It's happening in other countries too, and sooner rather than later, the time will come. Is this the beginning of the end of stamps ? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MESSAGE FROM A POSTAL SERVICE. (Israel Post)The Postal service in many countries is in decline. The service itself is in decline as is the management, know-how and just about everything connected to it. Of course there are exceptions. But they are too going down in number. In my village, the post has been ably dealt with since 1986 by the tried and trusted MP van (Mobile Post). I have taken my Philatelic mailings to our village community office where the mail is picked up, registered or express dealt with and it never crossed my mind back then, or indeed until recently, that things would change so much. I must have been inside my cocoon for too long. Three weeks ago it started. An innocent little trek to our village office to leave my mail for the Mobile Post Van. I even sorted the registered items by myself, I always have done. All they needed was a handstamp. But three weeks ago I couldn't get a handstamp ! Mobile Post vehicles will no longer carry handstamps with which to cancel registered mail !  The alternative ? A trek to the larger village a few kilometres away and queue up at the Post Office there ? Well, yes. And No !  Now we need to make an appointment to visit the Post Office. Fill in the form online, leave your mobile phone number, choose the time to visit (10 minutes per visit) and off you go. Easy, no ? Well yes. And no !  It now takes that full 10 minutes to fill out a customs form (now required for any international mail, with the exception of postcards). So not so bad eh ? Actually, yes. Really bad. From December 1st postage stamps can no longer be used on International Mail, registered or not. This means the end of most MP Vans, cut-backs within the service (it has already started) and I will now need to go to the post office to post simple letter !! Will it mean the end of new issues ? Yes, as we know it. Internal stamps are used on mail within the country and any valued stamps should be used up because they too will be phased out for mail within Israel, probably during 2024. I made an appointment at the Post Office this morning to send a registered letter. Having dealt with that, I then enquired about the use of stamps, prices, MPV's and more. I most likely annoyed a few waiting customers in the process but they were patient. It was sad news. But was it totally unexpected ? Not really. Yesterday I went to visit a Stamp Dealer friend in his shop and auction house in Tel Aviv. In between customers (yes, there were many, stamp collecting is alive and well here in the Middle East), he told me a story. He mailed a number of packets after his July auction to various customers abroad. He took them like he always did to his local post office. What local Post Office ?  Now the PO is in a Parcel delivery (courier) office and although some of the same staff work there, something was amiss. A few days later half of his International mailings were returned to him with the note 'Postage stamps can no longer be used on International mail' !!!!! Hence my enquiry this morning and the reason for this important post. IS YOUR POSTAL SERVICE IN DECLINE ? WHAT IS GOING ON WHEN YOU POST YOUR MAIL? TELL US HERE. In the meantime, I will try to figure out what I am going to do with all this postage. They are debating whether they can refund me or give me credit. I will not hold my breath !! (why should I worry, it's only $500 and it will end up in a politician's pocket anyway !!). Londonbus1 |
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Post by stamphinger on Aug 24, 2023 14:30:57 GMT
The Internet, smart phones and other digital innovations have rendered the mails no longer important to society. The only course for the posts is down and out.
StampHinger
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stainlessb
Member 
qaStaHvIS yIn 'ej chep
Posts: 4,649
What I collect: currently focused on most of western Europe, much of which is spent on France, Belgium, Germany and Great Britain Queen Victoria
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Post by stainlessb on Aug 24, 2023 14:51:18 GMT
It's hard to know what is going on with USPS... service has declined in recent years under the current leadership (Dejoy). THe closest post office tyo me is no longer open on Saturdays, and due to a staff shortage now opens at 8:30 (instead of 8:00) shuts down for lunch (12:00 - 1:00) . seldom are tyhere two clearks at the windows regardless of the line. International mail is an ordeal if it's much more than a greeting card or legal envelope with 2 pages inside...otherwise fill out customs forms... too thick, what's in in it> (and fill out customs forms)... odd size...(fill out.....) and the costs gets exorbitant very quickly. and they seem more inclined to run it trhrough the postal meter rather than affix stamps...
Even home delivery has diminished... i swear they purposley skip days of the week for my neighborhood, and quite often it is a different postal worker....
yes it appears th etimes they are a changing
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Cephus
Member
Posts: 161
What I collect: U.S. 1847-1993, Australia, China, New Zealand
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Post by Cephus on Aug 24, 2023 14:51:26 GMT
Which, frankly, I don't care about. It's a service whose time has come to go extinct. We still have millions of stamps to collect, but I haven't gotten anything new forever, nor do I have any interest. Virtually everything that comes out of the post offices these days looks like a 14-year old made it in Photoshop. They are stickers with no artistic merit. Where once, you got engraved pieces of art, today, it's just an ugly sticker, issued in numbers far too great. The post offices of the world have done themselves in. Time marches on. I'm willing to let them go.
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vikingeck
Member
Posts: 3,269
What I collect: Samoa, Tobacco theme, Mail in Wartime, anything odd and unusual!
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Post by vikingeck on Aug 24, 2023 15:23:00 GMT
Well as I am currently mailing anything between 6 and 15 eBay stamp sales in any week I depend on Royal Mail and it’s connections internationally . How else other than a physical letter to get a few stamps from Uk to Brazil, India, Texas , Wisconsin, London or Netherlands as I did yesterday and today ?
The Global Shipping programme offered by eBay is ridiculously expensive when £2 postage covers international letters.
Ps I always use stamps .
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philatelia
Member
Captain Jack - my best kiloware find ever!
Posts: 3,416
What I collect: Ireland, Japan, Scandy, USA, Venezuela, Vatican, Bermuda, Austria
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Post by philatelia on Aug 24, 2023 15:37:25 GMT
The small one ounce type letter mail is declining but with internet sales, parcel business is, if anything, busier. Here in the USA, the United States Postal Service is still the primary parcel service, even carrying other carriers loads across certain stretches. They have weird symbiotic arrangements.
So - no I can’t foresee any future without some sort of postal service.
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cjoprey
Member
Scanning stamps for my website...
Posts: 1,465
What I collect: Belgium (predominantly), British Commonwealth (older ones), WW (whatever comes my way...)
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Post by cjoprey on Aug 24, 2023 15:59:46 GMT
UK here - our local post office in my village went from 6 days per week to 3 mornings per week... Our very friendly and helpful postmaster tells me that sadly he will soon be forced to close permanently, and I will need to go to the post office counter in the convenience store in the next village if I need any postal support - or go to the post office in the main town 8 miles away. :/
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Post by carabop on Aug 24, 2023 16:01:04 GMT
Talking with several postmasters the rumor is stamps will be fazed out within the next 5 or so years. All will be meter type labels and most will be done online and not at post offices. I repeat this is all rumor for now nothing official. But I look at the source.
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JeffS
Member
Posts: 2,610
What I collect: Oranges Philately, US Slogan Cancels, Cape of Good Hope Triangulars, and Texas poster stamps and cinderellas
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Post by JeffS on Aug 24, 2023 19:45:50 GMT
 Says it all.
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swvl
Member
Posts: 525
What I collect: FDCs, plus some US modern and new issues. Topical interests include music, art, literature, baseball, space...
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Post by swvl on Aug 25, 2023 0:20:41 GMT
I agree with philatelia. People still use the mail here in the US quite often, even if it’s in different ways from how it was used in the past. The internet hasn’t killed the mail - in fact, online shopping has arguably given it new life. I’d be very sad if USPS stopped printing new stamps, since I’m one of those people who enjoys and collects many new U.S. issues. But I can’t see any indication that USPS is preparing itself for any such outcome. The number of newly issued stamps certainly doesn’t seem to be shrinking. |
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sudbury12000
Member
Posts: 315
What I collect: Canada, Great Britain, Germany, World Pre 1925
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Post by sudbury12000 on Aug 25, 2023 0:30:24 GMT
Canada Post seems to be doing well on the parcel service. I like vikingeck use the postal service to buy and sell stamps. In 23 years only one lost in Canada, so very reliable. I am not sure of the future of stamps though, I do collect recent Canada and US used, but the commems are harder to find. I have to post them to myself, it is a Christmas ritual now. I do think, and there is nothing that backs this up, but it seems that there is a slight uptick in the hobby. I could be wrong. |
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kasvik
Member
Posts: 546
What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
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Post by kasvik on Aug 25, 2023 2:12:02 GMT
Finally got both small children (visiting grandchildren) to bed, and just before, on our evening walk, found our cat, reported lost three weeks ago by our neighbors while we still were away.
It is very sad almost ridiculous news from Israel. But not a surprise. We all know stamps make as much sense to non-collectors as fountain pens and sock garters.
And it's easy to sympathize with postal authorities; no real letters, just crud nobody wants, no one using stamps, counterfeiting as common as not. Parcel service is all that's left for them, and then they compete with every Tom, Dick and DHL.
In the American countryside all those cute little post offices dotting the highways seem like congressionally mandated nostalgia. They make as much sense as Saturday delivery, another congressional mandate. I think Londonbus1 and cjoprey describe the future. Respect for tradition matters, but sooner or later...
I remember three years ago Iceland Post ceased issuing stamps. We all know a premonition when we feel one. Iceland Post is back now with a souvenir sheet, accompanied by assurances it is a unicorn.
Humbug.
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djcmh
Member
Posts: 773
What I collect: Worldwide
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Post by djcmh on Aug 25, 2023 3:51:50 GMT
My guess is that over the next decade postage stamps will become even more like commemorative coins issued by various mints around the world - meant not to be used by the public at large but targeted at the collector market. In the end though most postal administrations know that stamps remain a popular collectible and, generally, selling stamps to collectors represents a small, but steady, stream of profit on a minimal cost to produce. Nations do not need to produce them in huge print runs (and many nations have limited print runs as it is. For example Turkey (population 80 Million) only produces 100,000 copies of its average commemorative issue, while Romania (population around 20 million) only produces around 10,000 complete sets for each of its commemorative issues. @kasvik the new Iceland sheet was issued this week, and is truly a disappointment in my eyes. It was supposed to celebrate the 150th Anniversary of the first Icelandic Postage Stamp, but the design has nothing to do with the postal anniversary except for the caption on the stamp.  |
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angore
Member
Posts: 5,363
What I collect: WW, focus on British Empire
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Post by angore on Aug 25, 2023 10:32:40 GMT
In the US, the USPS handled 48,900,000,000 pcs of first class mail. Of this, 12,900,000,000 were first class single piece mail. Even though the volume has been decreasing (alarmist say a death spiral), this volume is still about what it was around 1970. When I lived in Raleigh there were often long lines at the closest post office (never had all windows open and when one clerk came another left) -- sorta like the DMV No such concept of line busting. This PO had a lot of business customers (mailing lots of flats) too. The local one now rarely has 1 or 2 in line and sometimes none so clerk is in back doing something else. I do see barcodes in the future with stamps only being sold to collectors. facts.usps.com/table-facts/ |
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kasvik
Member
Posts: 546
What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
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Post by kasvik on Aug 25, 2023 15:46:41 GMT
Yuck.
It's the best reason ever for killing the whole idea of commemoratives.
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Beryllium Guy
Moderator
Posts: 5,661
What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Aug 25, 2023 15:55:43 GMT
Gene ( djcmh), thanks for your post. I thought Iceland had stopped producing stamps last year or something? Or is what they're doing now exactly what you are talking about, i.e., just creating stamps to sell to collectors and that the stamps themselves are not intended to be used as postage? |
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stainlessb
Member
qaStaHvIS yIn 'ej chep
Posts: 4,649
What I collect: currently focused on most of western Europe, much of which is spent on France, Belgium, Germany and Great Britain Queen Victoria
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Post by stainlessb on Aug 25, 2023 16:20:54 GMT
Or is what they're doing now exactly what you are talking about, i.e., just creating stamps to sell to collectors and that the stamps themselves are not intended to be used as postage? When U N stamps became only valid if mailed from the U N the values plunged... My aunt was a big collector of U N , and I inherited here collection. Later in like she continued buying stamps, but did not keep the albums up. I inquired at several stamp dealers and got the same answer from each- The cost of a new album was almost twice the value of the stamps, bringing her album(s) up to date, close to the cost of the value of the stamps. One of the dealers was a dealer she had dealt with for years (she bought the UN stamps directly from the U N), told me he suggested several times that she would be better off spending her money on something other than the U N stamps. The last time he suggested it, she got angry and accused him of just trying to get her to buy more from him... she thought of stamps as an investment vehicle.... as a result I now have several U N collections and a whole bunch of US smaller denomination 'postage"..... |
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Post by stamphinger on Aug 25, 2023 16:44:21 GMT
Even though stamp issuing authorities cease issuing stamps, I believe there is a future for stamp and cover collecting. A parallel exists with matchbook collecting. It used to be that one could go in most any cafe, restaurant, hotel/motel, drug store, kiosk, ask for, and get a free book of matches, most of which displayed collectable advertising. However, with the decline of smoking in our societies, it is rare to find a book of advertising matches anywhere. My guess is that many Americans under 21 years of age have never even seen a match book.
Collecting them, however, continues with well defined topical specialization, just check out eBay. The same, should hold true for stamps and covers. However, given that fewer young people are aware of matchbooks and stamps, the number of collectors will decline over time to a point of stability in numbers, i.e. little or no increase or decrease. Anglobob, an Ecuadorian TSF member, tells me, that while Ecuador no longer has a postal service as most of us know it, the country still issues new stamps and there is a small collector base for them.
Bottom line for me is -- despite the loss of new issues by some countries, stamp collecting will continue, but with changing methods and focus.
Don StampHinger
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philatelia
Member
Captain Jack - my best kiloware find ever!
Posts: 3,416
What I collect: Ireland, Japan, Scandy, USA, Venezuela, Vatican, Bermuda, Austria
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Post by philatelia on Aug 25, 2023 17:00:36 GMT
OK don’t blow raspberries at me, but the four parts of the Iceland sheet - aurora, glacier?, lava, geological formation? are rather stunning representations of the incredibly wild and raw Icelandic scenery. It’s kinda cool in a modern art sort of way.
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Beryllium Guy
Moderator
Posts: 5,661
What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Aug 25, 2023 18:06:47 GMT
Terri ( philatelia ), I don't know if anyone is blowing raspberries at you (I am not), but I think Aaron's ( kasvik ) and Gene's ( djcmh ) point is that those images, no matter how interesting they are, seem totally disconnected from what the stamps are supposed to be commemorating, which is the 150th anniversary of the first Iceland postage stamp. That's my take on it, and honestly, I think they have raised a fair point. That said, I also appreciate your comment that the images are nice, too, because I think they are. Stay diversely stampy, all!  |
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djcmh
Member
Posts: 773
What I collect: Worldwide
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Post by djcmh on Aug 26, 2023 3:15:09 GMT
OK don’t blow raspberries at me, but the four parts of the Iceland sheet - aurora, glacier?, lava, geological formation? are rather stunning representations of the incredibly wild and raw Icelandic scenery. It’s kinda cool in a modern art sort of way. Oh the images are gorgeous, as one would expect from Iceland's Postal Service. But they have no connection whatsoever to the event being commemorated. Compare that to Iceland's 1973 Centenary of Stamps issue (at work so can't post image ATM). When Iceland Post suspended new issues, it said that new stamps would only be issued for significant national events. This issue came after lobbying from the main Philatelic Society in Iceland, though it appears they had no input on the design. So Iceland Post did give itself some wiggle room to issue new stamps if there was pressure to do so from outside groups, but they will not, at least under the current administrators of Iceland Post, have an annual program of stamps. Iceland Post says it doesn't need new stamps, they have plenty of back stock that can be used. But it didn't completely reject issuing new stamps if so requested. |
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philatelia
Member
Captain Jack - my best kiloware find ever!
Posts: 3,416
What I collect: Ireland, Japan, Scandy, USA, Venezuela, Vatican, Bermuda, Austria
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Post by philatelia on Aug 26, 2023 11:59:39 GMT
Yes, the design definitely lacks reference to stamps - true dat! Maybe after discontinuing new stamp issues they felt embarrassed designing a stamp that was a paean to philately? Kinda sorta kidding but kinda sorta not, eh.
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Cephus
Member
Posts: 161
What I collect: U.S. 1847-1993, Australia, China, New Zealand
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Post by Cephus on Aug 26, 2023 16:54:14 GMT
I've got a friend that I got into collecting stamps a couple of years ago, specifically Iceland as a dead country. I'm sure he's mad that it's not quite dead, since that's the only reason he's collecting it.
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angore
Member
Posts: 5,363
What I collect: WW, focus on British Empire
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Post by angore on Aug 27, 2023 10:17:32 GMT
It is no different than setting a cut off year since future issues do not affect the past.
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Post by nick2302 on Oct 3, 2023 14:03:02 GMT
Stamp collecting and stamp production helps the world stay in touch. We learn about so many things about a country from stamp collecting. If stamp publication drops off some in one way, it saves stamp collectors a lot of money. It also shortchanges people and places. We would never know about some areas of the world if it were not for stamps. I sincerely hope countries postal authorities take a hard look at stopping stamp publication. If they want to slow down to a couple of times a year that would be okay too. The fundamental movement of information is enhanced when received in the mail. Let's make sure our voices are heard about the benefits of stamps to our legislative representatives. We need to educate and share our experiences with stamp collecting so that the rest of the civilized countries of the world understand we will never know what is going on within their borders if they don't show some of what is happening in their corner of the world.
I hope if we ever establish a colony on Mars, we will be able to receive Marsean stamps. How great would that be!!
Nick
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Londonbus1
Moderator
Cinderella Stamp Club Member 3059
Posts: 4,884
What I collect: Cinderellas and some Ephemera from Great Britain, France and Israel plus a few beautiful bits from elsewhere !! Topical interests include Flags & Judaica, the latter with an emphasis on the Jewish National Fund.
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Post by Londonbus1 on Oct 5, 2023 18:25:11 GMT
Since my initial post back in August there have been a few developments. First I will say that I have visited (on purpose) 2 other post offices within the area I live. Neither Post Office knew anything about the changes I wrote about nor did I have to fill in forms to send registered mail. In some ways, this tells the poor state of the postal system here. I am still awaiting a reply from the main Office about my Mint Stamp enquiry. Recently, a group of collectors who had heard about the 'rumours' (?) formed a protest committee and are in discussion with the Post Office but finding out details has proved elusive. More to come and I hope good news. In the meantime I am using up my stamps without any problems and no customs forms. I also learned that Israel will not be alone in the event that stamps will not be allowed on International Mail. A number of East European countries have already adopted this idea and today I had my first item of proof ! A registered letter from Poland with the registered label and stamp all-in-one !!! Whatever next !!!  |
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It now takes that full 10 minutes to fill out a customs form (now required for any international mail, with the exception of postcards).
Now the PO is in a Parcel delivery (courier) office and although some of the same staff work there, something was amiss. A few days later half of his International mailings were returned to him with the note 'Postage stamps can no longer be used on International mail' !!!!!
Says it all.
