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Post by dosamaniac on Jul 6, 2024 17:58:10 GMT
This group of four India King George V 1r stamps (Scott #93) carries a 1935 postmark, but each stamp is also marked with a large "X" in violet ink. I didn't find a reference to this marking in the online Scott catalogue. After viewing the David Lean film "Passage to India" recently, which is set in the 1920s, I'm wondering if this marking might be a form of Indian anti-British sentiment.  |
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doug534
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A new enthusiast working toward a geographic and/or topical speciality or two in pre-1957 stamps.
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Post by doug534 on Jul 6, 2024 19:19:01 GMT
Thanks, dosamaniac. Would the X handstamp be applied during the same time frame (that is, during first use) as the cancellation postmark? If so, it seems equivalent to cancelling twice. Was this marking policy used during a particular period?
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Post by dosamaniac on Jul 6, 2024 19:58:21 GMT
I am not sure what you are trying to say. The preventive marks were applied by the bulk mailers, mostly business farms. The purpose is already stated. They are in no way cancels.
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rod222
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Post by rod222 on Jul 7, 2024 0:29:12 GMT
Theft prevention category A (marks applied by business, here is a telegram receipt)  Theft prevention category B marks applied by tying the stamp to the cover, by writing a script "stamped"  |
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DK
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What I collect: Classic NZ, Closed NZ Post Offices, New Zealand Postal History, Classic Br. Empire, Pacific Islands, France
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Post by DK on Jul 7, 2024 1:42:50 GMT
India : Theft prevention markings. These markings are, of course, New Zealand manuscript markings applied by the NZ Postmasters when a cancelling device wasn't available to cancel the postage stamps going thru' the mailstream. They are not Indian security markings as implied above. Cheers Dave |
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rod222
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Post by rod222 on Jul 7, 2024 1:58:25 GMT
Quote
These markings are, of course, New Zealand manuscript markings applied by the NZ Postmasters when a cancelling device wasn't available to cancel the postage stamps going thru' the mailstream.
They are not Indian security markings as implied above.
Cheers
Dave
Hi Dave
I cannot answer for the author of that sheet example, and we neither have the cover, to support any finding.
I do have India postage stamps, from a business in Calcutta (Kolkata) (New Zealand Indent Company) PERFIN NZI
47 Crawford street
Dunedin
The company started as a 1 man business in 1890 by one, Me Henry Markwald
(Cancelled by the Foreign Parcel Office, Calcutta)
Head Office 116 William Street Melbourne, and offices in India
According to "The Perfins of India and Indian States" (Magnus Werner)
the pattern is ID as being used by New Zealand Insurance Co Ltd
The inclusion of the mark in the sheet, was also curious to me, I just assumed it was some script on an example the author had
I cannot see why else he / she (Tony Aris) would have included it.
The squiggles certainly look like Indian script markings.
Do you recognise the "HI" postmark? adjacent to the Napier mark?
Cheers
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rod222
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Post by rod222 on Jul 7, 2024 2:15:25 GMT
Theft Prevention Markings on New Zealand Stamps Author Mr. Tony Aris (I neither support or disregard this information, just offered as FYI for collectors own opinions)  |
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doug534
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A new enthusiast working toward a geographic and/or topical speciality or two in pre-1957 stamps.
Posts: 95
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Post by doug534 on Jul 7, 2024 2:21:41 GMT
Being somewhat new to philately, maybe I am missing something in this discussion of theft preventive markings. My understanding is that the mark is intended to prevent theft (1) before the stamp goes on the cover, or (2) between the time it is placed on the cover and receives a cancellation mark. But if the post office accepts stamps on covers with anti-theft markings, why couldn't a stamp still be stolen and sold to the letter writers in the bazaar? Was it because the majority of Indians were poor and even if they "found" a marked stamp they would not dare to offer to sell it to someone wealthy enough to purchase it because of a culture among the wealthy of "don't buy a marked stamp because it must be stolen and the person selling it must be a thief." I am also wondering if theft-prevention marking was common in other countries, perhaps those with similar levels of disparity in wealth and poverty in the 19th century?
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rod222
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What I collect: Worldwide Stamps, Ephemera and Catalogues
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Post by rod222 on Jul 7, 2024 2:36:45 GMT
Being somewhat new to philately, maybe I am missing something in this discussion of theft preventive markings. My understanding is that the mark is intended to prevent theft (1) before the stamp goes on the cover, or (2) between the time it is placed on the cover and receives a cancellation mark. But if the post office accepts stamps on covers with anti-theft markings, why couldn't a stamp still be stolen and sold to the letter writers in the bazaar? Was it because the majority of Indians were poor and even if they "found" a marked stamp they would not dare to offer to sell it to someone wealthy enough to purchase it because of a culture among the wealthy of "don't buy a marked stamp because it must be stolen and the person selling it must be a thief." I am also wondering if theft-prevention marking was common in other countries, perhaps those with similar levels of disparity in wealth and poverty in the 19th century? Hi Doug, The large X etc, compare it to an PERFIN, it's simple use, is to prevent pilfering of postage stamps The large X and etc, were obvious enough, in its very design, any theft would be immediately recognisable, depending on the article, consider, also, the stamps so marked would have been recorded somewhere, on business records, for account reconciliation. The "stamped" and etc markings, tying the stamps to the cover, prevented any employee, or worker from soaking off the stamp/s and reusing them. Hope that helps |
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DK
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What I collect: Classic NZ, Closed NZ Post Offices, New Zealand Postal History, Classic Br. Empire, Pacific Islands, France
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Post by DK on Jul 7, 2024 2:46:22 GMT
Do you recognise the "HI" postmark? adjacent to the Napier mark? Yes. H1 was the designation at some point in time in the 1860-70 period, on a duplex cancel, that Napier office received. H for Hawkes Bay 1 for Napier (being the main city/town of that Province). BTW the 'N' designation went to the Nelson Province.  and some NZ Squiggles & 'X's on the Chalon series - these are m/s cancels made by the PO concerned when a cancelling device wasn't at hand:  NB Any of the above with postal cancels on them, alongside the m/s, were put there by the sorting office after being received from the originating office. Dave |
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rod222
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Post by rod222 on Jul 25, 2024 10:48:59 GMT
paul1
Hi Paul
"Ornate Cross"aka : A Fleuron, A Glyph, or a Dingbat. 
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paul1
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Post by paul1 on Jul 25, 2024 13:48:14 GMT
thanks rod - think I shall simply call it a 'decorative feature' :-):-) - however, appreciate your suggestions.
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Post by michael on Jul 25, 2024 17:46:44 GMT
I'm missing something here, it's either so obvious that no-one has mentioned it or it's a case of "Should have gone to Specsavers"  Surely the postmark is 'LATE FEE PAID' ? PS the Specsavers reference might only be understood by the Brits amongst us :-)
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paul1
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Post by paul1 on Jul 25, 2024 18:13:49 GMT
hi michael - thanks for your interest......... it's frustrating when a post - placed correctly in one sub-section - is hived off to another, surely better to keep the related comments together? - it might save the need to search and locate subsequent responses. However, I'm not a little mystified by your comments - do you not think that my words ............... "what is almost certainly part of a LATE FEE wording" ... would cover your thoughts?? :-):-)
You could be right that the Specsavers reference might be for Brits only:-) do you have any thoughts on the upper case F within the cancel ring?
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Post by dosamaniac on Jul 27, 2024 11:02:47 GMT
do you have any thoughts on the upper case F within the cancel ring? |
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paul1
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Post by paul1 on Jul 27, 2024 13:37:54 GMT
many thanks dosamaniac - quite a simple answer then :-)
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