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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2019 3:44:31 GMT
Thread started based on a comment shown later in this post
Yvert, SG & Scott have all produced Classic catalogs to 1940 so that's a good starting point for most collectors.
Since almost everyone here is more a general collector or country specific of limited means, the classification of 1840 to 1940 suits us well. If we had posts that limit stamps to say only pre 1890 or before they would be very short threads and TSF would have very few members.
The word classic stamp may have evolved - when I started collecting in 1972, stamps pre 1900 were still very plentiful and affordable. Now stamps prior to 1900 even 1940 are not so easily obtained.
I like to think of most classic stamps as being those that took some effort to produce and were intended primarily for ANY type of postal or fiscal use (Cinderellas being in their own category.). Most had a history of development and change. Some may have been rather simple and crude but they had a purpose and history. I am not a fan of countries that mass produce "collector" issues especially those that have CTO postmarks or are not recognized by the UPU, although even here there is some appeal especially for young or perhaps thematic collectors. Cost and ease of acquisition being an important factor.
Having said that, my real classics and interests like German/Italian States and Europe are pre-1900, so 1940 is what I might consider as a "fits all collectors" period.
Whatever happens in philately, going forward it will become increasingly difficult for any collectors to acquire stamps in whatever periods were deemed "classic".
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khj
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Post by khj on Mar 24, 2019 4:33:15 GMT
I'm technically one of those who tries to focus on the "classic period", so that would sort of be 1840-1940. Of course, Scott Classic actually includes pre-QEII British Commonwealth. I guess I'm one of those who lets the catalog define what I focus on. Historically, there have been debates on what constitutes the "classic period", with debates over 1840-1870, -1875, -1900, -1920, -1940... Each gives their own reason, ranging from printing, catalogs, traditional album cutoffs, UPU... with many of the reasons meaningful in their own right.
In reality, I'll collect anything that catches my fancy, not limited to pre-QEII. In fact, I probably have more QEII era stamps than pre-QEII. So much for discipline.
Given that, I'm one of those who feels even modern "sticker" stamps are fine. Whatever gets people's attention and attracts potential future collectors. When I started collecting, I really like the US 3¢ commemoratives. There was some criticism in the late 1940s and early 1950s regarding the large increase in quantity of different issues and the "value" of some of the topics commemorated. I didn't come along until well after that, but I found some of those "nonsensical" commemoratives enjoyable to collect.
Effort into print is important, I agree. But in reality, some of the earliest postage issues were nothing more than handstamps, or perforated handstamps. Some of them fetch some pretty outrageous sums. I enjoy a well-engraved mono-color stamp. But I will also admit that I'm really piqued by innovative printing/material of some modern stamps -- glow-in-the-dark, heat-sensitive, scratch-n-sniff, holographic, raised surfaces/ink...
I guess, it goes back to what I've mentioned in the past -- collect what you want, the way you want, because it's your collection and your enjoyment.
Interesting thread topic!
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hrdoktorx
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What I collect: France (and French territories), Africa, Canada, USA, Germany, Guatemala, stamps about science, flags, maps, stamps on stamps...
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Post by hrdoktorx on Mar 24, 2019 8:07:34 GMT
In France, the "classics" usually refer to the stamps issued before 1900. But there is also, as already mentioned, the "Classic" Yvert catalog that spans the first century of stamp issues (1840-1940), so many people go by that definition. In my case, since most of my collection is focused on African countries, I consider the "classical" period to cover the colonial issues, followed by a "semi-classical" one where the issues are still engraved and show a lot of workmanship (so the 1960s and early 1970s), before photographic plates take over. The older European issues, from the countries I collect, at least, I do try to get, but I am not overly moved by them, for the most part, especially considering the amount of money that can be involved, as I find them pictorially less interesting. But I fully understand how other collectors would see the appeal in them.
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Post by classicalstamps on Mar 24, 2019 9:19:09 GMT
Many collectors collect to "the album" or according to <insert name of catalog here>. This is an easy approach.
The first definition of "Classics" I've seen referenced is the "Age of Innocence" from 1840-1870. Before postal authorities started to produce stamps for collectors. Since then the classic period have been extended several times. This is very much driven by producers of catalogs. Today, most consider the cut-off to be 1940.
I'm curious what people think of the different cut-offs: 1870, 1900 or 1940. Do you base your decision on what your favourite catalog says?
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blaamand
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Currently creating custom pages until 1940.
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What I collect: Worldwide - Stamps and Postmarks - not enough time...
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Post by blaamand on Mar 24, 2019 9:30:05 GMT
Interesting thread @falshung As many others I am a general WW collector, but prefer the 'classics'. I am generally thinking of classics as until until WW1 or thereabouts, which fits in quite well to include all the Victoria's and KE7's of the Commonwealth. I do not base this on any catalogs, more the fact that the world saw dramatic changes around this time in history, imperialism where on it's peak and started its decline. WW1 changed the world map completely with loss of old empires or superpowers - and the emergence of new super powers. Normally these old stamps are what I am looking for when 'shopping', but still don't haven't made my mind up on any cut-off year for collecting in general, so I generally still collect 'everything'! As already stated lots of - or even most of - the countries have started to mass-produce stamps. Even the countries that earlier put most effort into producing the most beautiful stamps have now started to mass-produce, good example being France. France is my favorite collecting area, but unfortunately the issuing regime gone wild after year 2000 makes the recent issues uninteresting. Which is in sharp contrast to the classical period, where France had very limited number of issues - but all the more iconic and interesting.
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angore
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What I collect: WW, focus on British Empire
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Post by angore on Mar 24, 2019 10:37:10 GMT
I focus on mainly on 1900-1980 so definitely in the modern area.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2019 11:59:16 GMT
What started this thread
A response in the Switzerland Classics 1843- 1940 Thread I have to admit,that I have a different opinion about the term "classics" in regard to postage stamps. In the case of Switzerland I would include all stamps up to the Sitting Helvetia - series of 1881. With most other countries I make the cut around 1870. I think classics are those stamps what were issued for the payment postal fees only. This excludes commemoratives,semi-postals etc. But for sure the "real modern" stamps of 1920th and 1930th are of a different kind,than the classics. But this is my personal opinion,other people may have different ideas.
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Beryllium Guy
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What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Mar 24, 2019 18:45:24 GMT
Thanks for starting this thread, Nelson (@falshung ). I confess that I missed the original comment in the Switzerland thread by Werner ( salentin ) that prompted this discussion. For me, I think that definitions of "classic" stamps will differ from place to place, from catalogue publisher to catalogue publisher, and from collector to collector. I am not troubled by that, as we each put our collections together based on what we each find to be most interesting, logical, appropriate, or by whatever criteria we each determine. To my thinking, this is an individual choice to which we are all entitled. Just because my interpretation of what I consider classic may be different from someone else's interpretation doesn't bother me. I try to be tolerant of others' opinions just as I hope that they will be tolerant of mine. All of that said, I agree that most publishers of catalogues and albums consider 1840-1940 to be the usual classic period, but as Scott goes all the way to 1952 for British Commonwealth classics, I can see that stretching the time period to the early 1950s can also make sense. That is how Scott is choosing to do it, and one can either embrace that, too, or choose another direction. It's your choice. For me personally, I have chosen to limit my primary collecting era to 1840-1930, but that was driven mostly by my desire to limit the size of my collection, and because I had an album that covered that period. As it happens, I still add stamps to my collection if I like them, even if they fall outside of that period. My collection, my choice. Live and let live works for me. No matter how you define the classic period for stamps, I do like the early material the best, and I will continue to focus my collecting towards that era, gravitating in general towards older and older material.
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renden
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What I collect: Canada-USA-France-Lithuania-Austria--Germany-Mauritius-French Colonies in Africa
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Post by renden on Mar 24, 2019 19:20:19 GMT
For me, I think that definitions of "classic" stamps will differ from place to place, from catalogue publisher to catalogue publisher, and from collector to collector. I am not troubled by that, as we each put our collections together based on what we each find to be most interesting, logical, appropriate, or by whatever criteria we each determine. To my thinking, this is an individual choice to which we are all entitled. Just because my interpretation of what I consider classic may be different from someone else's interpretation doesn't bother me. I try to be tolerant of others' opinions just as I hope that they will be tolerant of mine. For me personally, I have chosen to limit my primary collecting era to 1840-1930, but that was driven mostly by my desire to limit the size of my collection, and because I had an album that covered that period. As it happens, I still add stamps to my collection if I like them, even if they fall outside of that period. My collection, my choice. Live and let live works for me. Thanks Chris Beryllium Guy for your thoughts - just quoted a few paragraphs - Since I just bought Scott's e-version of the 2019 Scott Classic Specialized catalogue 1840-1940, I try to stick with that period. However, for certain Countries (ex: Canada and US) I might go to 1970s but do not consider these stamps "classic" René
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darkormex
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Swinging through Switzerland and getting tied up in Thailand
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What I collect: The World...just printing and mounting as I go...call me crazy!
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Post by darkormex on Mar 24, 2019 20:34:59 GMT
I agree with much of what khj says. When I was living in Korea, I started expanding my collecting from my original core collections US, Canada and Russia (and others) to include South Korea and I was starting to accumulate a lot of worldwide items that caught my fancy. It was also at that time that Scott was pushing their 4 volume Scott International 1840-1940 set that you could buy for roughly $300.00. This was in the 90s and I asked for it as a Christmas gift from my mother and received it. Once I moved back to the US from Korea in the late 90s I thought I would solely concentrate on classics and started selling off much of what I had accumulated except for some core collections. I quickly realized, however, that the Scott International set was disappointing. I wanted something more complete and the stamp layout was still that old layout with rows of printed boxes with no space in between and the pages were double-sided, which, in my opinion is just silly. So I set this idea aside for awhile. Plus my wife and I had a 1 year old son and later another child and I only intermittently worked on stamps. Later, however, once our lives had settled into a new pattern and I was able to find time to work on stamps again, I discovered Steiner. This kinda blew the lid off of my plans as a classics collector. I bought his CD with both his classic pages and worldwide pages to 2010 and I quickly realized I could print and collect whatever I wanted. I also realized there was no more need to update my old Scott albums (or any other pre-printed albums for that matter) with expensive album supplements. I also feel that Steiner and the personal computer sort of revolutionized stamp collecting because we were no longer tied to companies manufacturing expensive pre-printed albums and expensive annual supplements. I personally love to have the ability to just print when I want and collect what I want and not feel as if it is going to be a huge expense to start collecting another country. I still like the idea of collecting classics and when I buy a collection like the India stamps that I bought yesterday at the show I attended, I am more likely to buy something with classic stamps in it than otherwise, and for all the same reasons stated above by khj and @falshung . In the end, however, I really subscribe to the philosophy of "collect what you want, the way you want, because it's your collection and your enjoyment".
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loupy
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Back and active, thank you!
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What I collect: US to 2000 with a focus on 720 & 721, WW 1840 - 1930, DDR 5 year workers, Machins, Canada Centennials, Brazil Allegories, Mexico Archiecture & Archaeology 1950 -75, used stamps preffered when possible.
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Post by loupy on Mar 24, 2019 23:07:54 GMT
I enjoy the older "Classic" stamps too, and collect them in an old Scott's 1930 International, so I'm 1840 - 1930 and that works wonderfully well for me. This has been a 20 year pursuit, with many thousands mounted and more slowly trickling in as my miserly stamp budget allows. I also find that I tend to like to fill in some of the expensive stamp spaces with common stamps that have nice cancels which have eye appeal to the viewer.
Another bonus is that a 1999 Scott's Classic Catalogue fulfills all my needs in that department without needing a newer one. If I find a more valuable stamp, then it's updated value is easily ascertained on the web.
In the summer months I enjoy surveying my album while reclining in a shaded back porch hammock, which is one of the best pleasures in life.
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khj
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Post by khj on Mar 24, 2019 23:39:44 GMT
Ah, the Scott 1999 Classic -- softcover and lightweight. One dealer was clearing them out for a couple of bucks, so I bought an extra one and used it to mark my inventory with a light red color pencil. Carried it to shows as a "ready-checklist". Don't do that anymore, but does bring back memories.
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blaamand
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Currently creating custom pages until 1940.
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Post by blaamand on Mar 25, 2019 0:52:10 GMT
khj - We must be kindred spirits, I did the same. 😊
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hrdoktorx
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What I collect: France (and French territories), Africa, Canada, USA, Germany, Guatemala, stamps about science, flags, maps, stamps on stamps...
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Post by hrdoktorx on Mar 25, 2019 7:50:37 GMT
I bought an extra one and used it to mark my inventory with a light red color pencil. Carried it to shows as a "ready-checklist". That is my preferred method as well. Which is why my cataloguing efforts take so long, as I mark everything I had in the new books. But I find that I cannot rely on memory alone anymore to remember what I have or not. Hopefully more a question of having a larger inventory than my memory stack allows, instead of my own memory faltering because of growing up in years!
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stainlessb
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qaStaHvIS yIn 'ej chep
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What I collect: currently focused on most of western Europe, much of which is spent on France, Belgium, Germany and Great Britain Queen Victoria
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Post by stainlessb on Mar 25, 2019 13:39:06 GMT
Interesting thread! Thanks to all for your thoughts. When I recently returned to my stamp collection, prompted by an inheritance and the subsequent need to "do something with all these boxes!" (at my wifes urging)- My plan was to sort/catalog/and dispose of all but US up to 1950/60, which was a date range chosen because that's about when I started collecting. I also didn't find the more "modern" issues to be that interesting, being more mass produced without a great deal of creativity (although I'm sure many would disagree). The early stamps (to me) are much more artful, the designs often quite delicate, and based on the technology of the times, rather amazing.
Now 6 months back into 'stamping" I've expanded my collecting interests to include weastern Europe (including Great Britain) and I am trying to decide exactly where to establish my "cut off" date. Maybe WWII, or maybe 1940, or maybe I just don't know yet... The utilization of computers and printing of pages is a game changer as I do remember the frustration of supplemental pages, not only the cost, but the time to integrate them into my albums each time...especially if I'd missed a release.
I agree, collect what you want, how you want, as ultimately your collection is uniquely your passion, your joy!
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Post by greaden on Mar 25, 2019 18:17:17 GMT
The Scott Classical catalog would be more useful if they extended their stopping point for Germany from 1940 to 1945.
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blaamand
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Currently creating custom pages until 1940.
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Post by blaamand on Mar 26, 2019 7:51:12 GMT
greaden - Good point, I agree! However not only for Germany - lots of countries around the globe were affected by WW2 and the unstability that followed in one way or another. Hence I think it would be useful if Scott could cover until end of '45 to better cover those "effects of history". khj - Absolutely!!
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vikingeck
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What I collect: Samoa, Tobacco theme, Mail in Wartime, anything odd and unusual!
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Post by vikingeck on May 7, 2019 17:03:08 GMT
For over 30 years my major collection was the Classic issues of Denmark 1851-64 the so called "Square Stamps". I got hooked on these when asked to assist a friend with a pre 1940s classic album he had inherited. A dealer had offered him £200 so he wanted a second opinion. Page 1 India used in Aden blew my socks off! We got him £5000 after 18 months trading and I got a couple of "little Square stamps". The collection was sold in 2016 via Postiljonen in Sweden and these remain: AS a token collection of Classics I'm building a collection of 1st Issues of Europe. I have to confess Italy and German States I treat with great caution!
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frstamp
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What I collect: Europe, Asia some S.America up to 1960
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Post by frstamp on May 7, 2019 20:40:42 GMT
The original post was what you consider to be the classic period Most would probably consider going along with 1840-1940 as many "classic catalogs" do Some areas might be extended such as Germany to 1945 or Br. Commonwealth to 1953. The early issues whether elaborate or crude had a certain charm and generally a history behind them something lacking in modern stamps. I doubt future books will have the title "The Postal History of XXXXXX from 2000 to 2020" For "purists" classics might end with a specific time period Germany - Empire, Russia - Pre Civil War, a change of currency or government. Personally when stamps ceased to be hand produced (whether engraved, litho or otherwise) my interest seriously waned.
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