Will
Member 
Inactive
Posts: 84
What I collect: Venezuela: ESCUELAS 1871-1880, Locals up to 1903. Cinderellas and BOB | Colombia: Up to 1940. States!
|
Post by Will on Jul 25, 2019 1:23:33 GMT
Hey, I wonder if there are more cases like this one out there. In 1991, Venezuelan government opened a public contest to design the stamp that was going to commemorate the 500 years of the discovery of America and also the attending of the country to Expo Sevilla 92. Mauricio Sanchez impressed the authorities with his design:  It was pretty obvious that none in the government knew about these colombian banknotes.  It's... kinda funny. And sad at the same time. The work the "designer" did was terrible. Do you folks know cases like this one? |
|
Beryllium Guy
Moderator 
Posts: 5,912 
What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
|
Post by Beryllium Guy on Jul 25, 2019 11:44:10 GMT
Will , thanks for an interesting post. It has gotten me thinking, which is always a dangerous consequence! I suppose before I were to call this a case of straightforward plagiarism, I would need to know more of the back story. To me, it looks like a piece of collage-style art, that used elements from a cut-up bank note combined with other things. It's not exactly brilliant or anything, but I have seen other types of collages that used images from magazines, newspapers, product labels, bank notes, stamps, etc. I would not rate such things very high on the originality scale since most of the elements are taken from other images, text, or objects, but I also don't find it terrible, either, and I am not sure it really qualifies as plagiarism, which I have always thought to mean taking someone else's original work and claiming it as your own original work. All of that said, I would have to imagine that you are right about this case from the point of view that no one in the Venezuelan Government realized that they were looking at collage art which used a Colombian bank note for a large part of its underlying image. If they had realized it, I imagine that they would not have used it. But I am not really sure if I think that this is plagiarism or not. Anyway, excellent thought-provoking subject, Will! If I run across any other images in my collection or elsewhere that I think can add to this theme, I will be sure to post them.
|
|
Will
Member
Inactive
Posts: 84
What I collect: Venezuela: ESCUELAS 1871-1880, Locals up to 1903. Cinderellas and BOB | Colombia: Up to 1940. States!
|
Post by Will on Jul 25, 2019 21:46:32 GMT
Beryllium Guy Wow, your comment immediately reminded me of a good co-worker I have that always make me think twice about my take on things. Sorry about that, I shouldn't have called it terrible. And you are right... More context here will help us make a fair judgement. For instance: What were the rules? Was ok to base your work on others? I do think, however, that he should've given credit where credit was due!
|
|
kasvik
Member
Posts: 607
What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
Member is Online
|
Post by kasvik on Jul 26, 2019 12:17:08 GMT
Will started an excellent thread.
The resemblance in the Venezuelan and Colombian images of the San Agustin Archaeological Park is obvious; it is the same engraving. But it may not be anything sneaky. Is it possible both used the same die or engraving, owned by the same printer? There is a habit of re-using imagines, going back almost to the origin of printed currency, securities and stamps. It was tempting; the printers owned the elements and the steel engraving process made it easy to re-use the bits.
Philatelic writers have been interested in copying for a long time: Norman Thornton, ‘Similarities of design’, Gibbons Stamp Weekly, 5 December 1908, pp. 361-63. And I would wager a small bet that article was not completely original.
But the San Agustin Archaeological Park is purely Colombian, right? In 1991-92 relations between Colombia and Venezuela probably were a lot better than now, but there is a big part of the story missing.
|
|
angore
Member
Posts: 5,700
What I collect: WW, focus on British Empire
|
Post by angore on Jul 26, 2019 12:26:14 GMT
Of course, the USPS lost a court case for using a photo of an image of the Liberty statue in Las Vegas.
|
|
Will
Member
Inactive
Posts: 84
What I collect: Venezuela: ESCUELAS 1871-1880, Locals up to 1903. Cinderellas and BOB | Colombia: Up to 1940. States!
|
Post by Will on Jul 26, 2019 14:23:06 GMT
|
|
Will
Member
Inactive
Posts: 84
What I collect: Venezuela: ESCUELAS 1871-1880, Locals up to 1903. Cinderellas and BOB | Colombia: Up to 1940. States!
|
Post by Will on Jul 26, 2019 14:35:23 GMT
Is it possible both used the same die or engraving, owned by the same printer? There is a habit of re-using imagines, going back almost to the origin of printed currency, securities and stamps. It was tempting; the printers owned the elements and the steel engraving process made it easy to re-use the bits. I have to admit that my knowledge on printing methods in very very limited (on a good day) but I'd imagine that if that would've been the case, the attempt to block the "10 Pesos Oro" in the top would've been much better... Also, I'd doubt a regular person would have access to those die/engravings. If if that was an arrangement between institution, then the venezuelan government would've known that the winning submission was heavily based on a previous work. Mysteries!  Philatelic writers have been interested in copying for a long time: Norman Thornton, ‘Similarities of design’, Gibbons Stamp Weekly, 5 December 1908, pp. 361-63. And I would wager a small bet that article was not completely original. Love the irony here |
|
vikingeck
Member
Posts: 3,551
What I collect: Samoa, Tobacco theme, Mail in Wartime, anything odd and unusual!
|
Post by vikingeck on Jul 26, 2019 14:53:38 GMT
I have always been interested in where stamp designs came from and at the very beginning following on from the GB penny Black many early issues incorporate the same elements, Human face , Coat of arms, similar frames and size. all of these have little stars in the corners , and there are many others I could add.  |
|
vikingeck
Member
Posts: 3,551
What I collect: Samoa, Tobacco theme, Mail in Wartime, anything odd and unusual!
|
Post by vikingeck on Jul 26, 2019 14:55:35 GMT
This however is a straight steal for Dominican Republic from the USA design  |
|
kasvik
Member
Posts: 607
What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
Member is Online
|
Post by kasvik on Jul 30, 2019 16:06:06 GMT
Not to worst, but one of the better known: Sweden’s King Oscar II 10 öre regular of 1884, famously based on the Continental Bank Note Company's American Hamilton 30 cent of 1870. It was Sweden’s first royal portrait stamp. Maybe that’s why they played it safe with a proven design.
The Hamilton stamp frame has been used with a different vignette: the same sculptured escutcheon, ellipse, captioning and bottom ribbon. The Swedes changed the aspect ratio, switched the shading technique, filled the corners with decorative elements (cute little post horns) surrounded the vignette with a pearl-lined ellipse, and ignored the shield around the number value.
The King must have liked it; it stayed in use for 25 years. The Hamilton can be one of the pricier stamps in a US collection, a weirdy used mostly for foreign registered letters, if I have that right. Someone please set me right on that. The Oscar II was Sweden’s basic regular for 25 years, re-engraved and printed in several versions. It is cheap (if cancelled) and fills pages in most any Sweden collection. 
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2024 10:49:35 GMT
Came to this thread after A. Finding the following stamps in my collection and B. Reading about the Norwegian Posthorn stamps being copied in the Cretan Posthorn stamps exactly 1 to 1. Hungary, 1959  South Vietnam, 1974  |
|
