de61
Member 
Posts: 262
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Post by de61 on Mar 23, 2020 20:35:05 GMT
Per stamphinger 's thread in the post thestampforum.boards.net/post/92701: By way of further explanation, I also collect covers with variant airmail borders and some cover dealers credit Ioor with producing some of the borders using words and phrases... I have never seen any written evidence that Ioor designed and had printed this airmail border, or any other like it, but I keep looking for proof. The phrase "Special Envelopes for Special Purposes" on the Ioor label in my original post above lends credence to the claim. Perhaps, he did design covers like this and sold them to organizations and individuals for special mailings. All interesting to me, but the topic needs its own thread and I don't wish to hijack this one more than I have. Don StampHinger Following are some of Ioor's first day covers with text borders.      |
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de61
Member
Posts: 262
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Post by de61 on Mar 23, 2020 20:38:44 GMT
One from Detroit-Ludwig, listed as Planty C34-11.  |
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de61
Member
Posts: 262
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Post by de61 on Mar 23, 2020 20:42:34 GMT
A first day cover for C26, listed as an unknown cachet designer in the Planty catalog. It is to McCamley, an occasional cachet producer, so it may be by him.  |
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Post by stamphinger on Mar 24, 2020 12:07:09 GMT
Thanks for starting this thread to continue the discussion of Harry Ioor's airmail border covers. While I don't disbelieve that Ioor designed the airmail borders you posted, I have never seen a signature of any kind on any of those attributed to him. The only references I have seen are undocumented statements by an occasional cover dealer. The closest I have come is the statement in his mailing label on the cover I posted in the Slogan Cancels thread. What is the source of your statement quoted above?
I did a little more internet research since posting in Slogan Cancels and confirmed that Harry Ioor's title and occupation was Doctor of Chiropractic. I also found a snipit in a Linns article that there was a "printery" in the stamp shop that he and his sister owned, that his cachets were printed in that shop, and that he or his sister favored the color purple, but no indication that he also printed custom airmail borders. For me, however, there is little doubt that the design and colors of the examples you posted are similar enough to have been done by the same person. As a collector of these borders, I would very much like to find a source confirming they were done by Ioor.
Regarding your post about the unknown cachet designer, i.e. the one with the smiling aviator in the "keep' 'em flying" cachet, that cachet is attributed to Cachet Craft with John Coulthard as the artist. The art and colors used are very much in Coulthard's style.
Looking forward to your reply.
Don
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de61
Member
Posts: 262
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Post by de61 on Mar 24, 2020 14:18:50 GMT
Thanks for starting this thread to continue the discussion of Harry Ioor's airmail border covers. While I don't disbelieve that Ioor designed the airmail borders you posted, I have never seen a signature of any kind on any of those attributed to him. The only references I have seen are undocumented statements by an occasional cover dealer. The closest I have come is the statement in his mailing label on the cover I posted in the Slogan Cancels thread. What is the source of your statement quoted above?
Regarding your post about the unknown cachet designer, i.e. the one with the smiling aviator in the "keep' 'em flying" cachet, that cachet is attributed to Cachet Craft with John Coulthard as the artist. The art and colors used are very much in Coulthard's style.
Looking forward to your reply.
Don
Hi Don: First off, I should have been more descriptive in my original post. The information sources are Planty's Photo Encyclopedia of Cacheted First Day Covers, Mellone's Planty Photo Encyclopedia of Cacheted First Day Covers, and Mellone's Specialized Cachet Catalog of First Day Covers. The individual covers shown are listed as: Variety of Planty-Mellone CE1-13 Planty-Mellone 758a-2 Planty-Mellone C23-117. The label at the top left corner is an etiquette and not part of the envelope design. Variety of Planty-Mellone 821-1 Variety of Planty-Mellone 853-35 There is also an Ioor Specialized Catalog of his FDCs, which I have seen, but do not have. Both Planty and Mellone reference many of Ioor's cachets as being available with airmail border varieties, but neither shows them because Ioor produced so many varieties of his cachets for each stamp issue. For example, there are over 150 color varieties for the 1939 Presidential Series (Prexy) alone. I base my attribution of the text borders to Ioor on the few examples of these without cachet in the Planty's and Mellone's catalogs, such as the C23-117. All that being stated, I too have never seen any of the "airmail border only" envelopes with a signature or printed Ioor designation. Perhaps more information can be found in the Ioor Specialized Catalog, if either of us can get our hands on a copy. Thank you for the additional research on Harry Ioor. Thanks also for the note about attributing the "Keep 'Em Flying" cachet to John Coulthard for Cachet Craft. I agree that it is Coulthard's style and always considered it to be one of his cachets, but neither Planty nor Mellone ever attributed this cover to him, which I found to be odd. Don |
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kasvik
Member
Posts: 542
What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
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Post by kasvik on May 20, 2020 17:25:13 GMT
This is all stamphinger Don's influence. I wouldn't have appreciated it without. Alexandria Egypt (United Arab Republic!) to Geneva, 11 June 1964. Not first day or first flight, but quite the air mail border. Maybe it was created for the tourist trade. But who could say no? Not me; I paid four dollars + postage from Sweden. What on Earth was it doing there?
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Post by stamphinger on May 20, 2020 23:41:50 GMT
Hi Kasvik:
Great cover! There is a series of this style airmail border out of Egypt. I have four or five. Most mailed to European addresses, but don't believe I have one sent to Sweden. Very attractive in my opinion. I'll post those I have for reference tomorrow. Yours at $4 plus shipping was a good buy. I'm glad to see someone else showing interest in variant airmail borders. They can become addictive.
Don
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Post by stamphinger on May 22, 2020 15:54:05 GMT
Hi @kasvik: Below are my covers from the Egyptian airmail border series that I refer to as Egyptian Scenes Borders. Your example is the oldest one I have and I won't repeat it here. It dates back to 1963.
The next one is dated 1966 mailed in Alexandria and included a letter about a stamp trade from which I dated the cover and placed it from Alexandria: This one also from Alexandria in 1967, probably a pen pal letter:
A different design partially continued on the reverse, also with Egyptian symbols screened onto the envelope's writing area. This one is between the same correspondents as my first scan above. Again with an accompanying letter regarding a stamp trade. The letter indicates the sender was a judge. A non-philatelic cover that has suffered a little on opening at the hands of the Chamber of Commerce mail clerk. The cover appears to have been posted at Heliopolis-West which I take to be a post office or station in Cairo. Kasvik, I also bought this one from a dealer in Sweden. My last design of this series. The postmark is barely visible at bottom center, but there is an --iro in the cancel dial, so I have placed it from Cairo and dated it as Ca 1981. The date is based on a faint 8- in the date portion of the cancel dial and the stamp was not issued until 1981. A return address on the reverse indicates the letter originated at the U.S. Embassy, NAMRU, FPO, New York, NY. The border design continues on three sides of the reverse. This border design is similar to the 1967 pen pal cover above.  I have one other very original airmail border design from Egypt, but it is not at al similar to this series so I have not included it here. While I have no proof, I believe the above designs are all commercially manufactured airmail stationery readily available in Egypt during the time periods of posting. I purchased most of them on eBay with maybe one or two coming from DelCampe listings.
It has been some time since I have seen a different design similar to the above. Kasvik, if you should find any different designs out of Egypt, I hope you will post them here.
Don Stamphinger
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Post by luciano on May 22, 2020 19:11:59 GMT
Wonderful cover 👏👏👍👍
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kasvik
Member
Posts: 542
What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
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Post by kasvik on May 22, 2020 23:42:45 GMT
Hi @kasvik: Below are my covers from the Egyptian airmail border series that I refer to as Egyptian Scenes Borders. Your example is the oldest one I have and I won't repeat it here. It dates back to 1963. |
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Post by stamphinger on Oct 16, 2020 20:16:27 GMT
With a fortuitous eBay purchase I added five covers to my Egyptian airmail borders collection. All to the same addressee, International Youth Service, and dated between 1992 and 1995. The International Youth Service is a Finland based organization that matches young people 10 to 20 years old for an exchange of letters. It appears to be still operating (a link to its home page: penpallingandletters.blogspot.com/2010/02/iys-international-youth-service-founded_06.html I am assuming that this was the objective of these letters coming out of Egypt. There are two styles of borders on the front, but all have different scenes on the reverse.
StampHinger ]  |
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Post by stamphinger on Dec 14, 2020 21:21:20 GMT
A couple more Egyptian airmail covers with variant borders and scenes that I found on eBay. These two are non-philatelic in that they are addressed to a U.S. immigration office apparently seeking information about Green Cards. Both have 1995 cancels, one with an Alexandria return address, the other origin unknown. Both headed fro my Variant Airmail Borders cover collection.
Don StampHinger  |
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Post by stamphinger on Feb 21, 2021 23:43:03 GMT
I recently acquired another small cache of Egyptian airmail covers with ancient Egyptian scenes on the reverse. They are all addressed to the International Youth Service in Finland, a pen pal organization that matches correspondents for the exchange of personal letters. I now have eleven of these covers with different designs. Watching for one more, surely they would be produced in a set of twelve. Four of the recent acquisitions are below.
Don StampHinger   |
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Post by smauggie on Feb 22, 2021 2:26:25 GMT
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kasvik
Member
Posts: 542
What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
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Post by kasvik on May 26, 2022 19:25:28 GMT
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Post by stamphinger on May 27, 2022 12:01:50 GMT
Kasvic:
Great cover! I have not seen another like it in the twenty years collecting these covers! If still available when I get back home, I'm going to bid on it.
Don StampHinger
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