darkormex
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What I collect: The World...just printing and mounting as I go...call me crazy!
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Post by darkormex on Apr 8, 2020 3:17:39 GMT
I noticed there was not a thread for Dutch perfins so here are a couple to start one off. Can anyone identify the organizations these perfins represent?   |
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stanley64
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What I collect: Canada, USA, Netherlands, Portugal & Colonies, Antarctic Territories and anything that catches my eye...
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Post by stanley64 on Apr 8, 2020 6:53:55 GMT
Nice one darkormex , perfins are always fun to find! As for the three Netherlands ones shared here, from left to right: G.S. - N.V. Gebroeders Sluis' Zaadteelt en Zaadhandel (Enkhuizen) HC - ? H.C. Hagemeijer & Co's Handelmaatschappij N.V., exporthandel (Amsterdam) Depending on the level of interest for you and others, one may want to consider adding a copy of J.L. Verhoeven en N. van der Lee's Catalogue Dutch Perfins to the library shelves.
Happy collecting! |
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Beryllium Guy
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What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Apr 8, 2020 7:04:51 GMT
Nice stamps, Darren ( darkormex)! Thanks for starting this thread. Thanks for your response, Vince ( stanley64). Perhaps I am missing something, but I think that the two H.C. perfins are identical. One is just applied differently to the stamp, being inverted and/or reversed compared to the other, but it is the same one as near as I can tell. I have no special expertise in this area, but that's my opinion. Vince, I think you have already nailed it. No question marks needed.  |
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vikingeck
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What I collect: Samoa, Tobacco theme, Mail in Wartime, anything odd and unusual!
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Post by vikingeck on Apr 8, 2020 9:44:33 GMT
Nice stamps, Darren ( darkormex )! Thanks for starting this thread. Thanks for your response, Vince ( stanley64 ). Perhaps I am missing something, but I think that the two H.C. perfins are identical. One is just applied differently to the stamp, being inverted and/or reversed compared to the other, but it is the same one as near as I can tell. I have no special expertise in this area, but that's my opinion. Vince, I think you have already nailed it. No question marks needed. Because the perfins were applied individually with a hand operated lever punch, to save time, sheets would be folded end to end and the over again to allow at least 4 stamps to be done simultaneously. The folding explains why we get the same perfin normal , inverted, reversed, and reversed inverted ! |
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darkormex
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Swinging through Switzerland and getting tied up in Thailand
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What I collect: The World...just printing and mounting as I go...call me crazy!
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Post by darkormex on Apr 8, 2020 12:11:32 GMT
Thank you for your help with this, stanley64, Beryllium Guy and vikingeck. I will check out that link this evening. I collect perfins to some extent though I don't set them aside in their own collection. |
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vikingeck
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What I collect: Samoa, Tobacco theme, Mail in Wartime, anything odd and unusual!
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Post by vikingeck on Apr 8, 2020 15:15:56 GMT
I thought I had several but can only find this one at the moment Perfin "L.B."   [] |
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stanley64
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Post by stanley64 on Apr 8, 2020 16:57:59 GMT
Because the perfins were applied individually with a hand operated lever punch, to save time, sheets would be folded end to end and the over again to allow at least 4 stamps to be done simultaneously. The folding explains why we get the same perfin normal , inverted, reversed, and reversed inverted ! You learn something every day; thanks for the additional input vikingeck !
Not sure if you knew the origins of the perfin shared in your last posting here on the thread, but for the others the "L.B." on the stamp of Queen Wilhelmina is for an Amsterdam bedrif, "Erven Lucas Bols, Distilleerderij en Likeurstokerij" The image of Queen Wilhelmina was also used for the Suriname's issues of the same time period and apparently hashad their share of forgeries as shared in this posting, Forged stamps of Suriname (an interesting aside)...
Happy collecting!
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darkormex
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Swinging through Switzerland and getting tied up in Thailand
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What I collect: The World...just printing and mounting as I go...call me crazy!
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Post by darkormex on Apr 10, 2020 1:54:43 GMT
Here is another example of the H.C. Hagemeijer & Co's Handelmaatschappij N.V., exporthandel (Amsterdam), perfin in Sc. 243A, Gull definitive, 2 1/2c dk. green. At first the color description made me think otherwise but this stamp is photogravure rather than lithographed. I used my Machin identification skills for this...LOL.   |
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doug534
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Post by doug534 on Sept 15, 2024 16:14:48 GMT
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hdm1950
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What I collect: I collect world wide up to 1965 with several specialty albums added due to volume of material I have acquired. At this point I am focused on Canada and British America. I am always on the lookout for stamps and covers with postmarks from communities in Queens County, Nova Scotia. I do list various goods including stamps occasionally on eBay as hdm50
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Post by hdm1950 on Sept 15, 2024 19:04:04 GMT
doug534 you did nothing wrong soaking the stamp. The perforated back paper is interesting but I have no opinion of how it came to be. My guess on the 1-2-3 paper tag is that it may have been a home made hinge using scrap paper.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2024 21:35:07 GMT
My guess on the 1-2-3 paper tag is that it may have been a home made hinge using scrap paper. It still features the perfin and the stamp's perforations, though, meaning it must have been from the process of making the stamp, present before the perfin was applied. By the way, I'm Dutch, and in case you don't know, I'm pretty sure D.E. means Douwe Egberts, a famous Dutch coffee brand. I might be wrong though. |
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hdm1950
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What I collect: I collect world wide up to 1965 with several specialty albums added due to volume of material I have acquired. At this point I am focused on Canada and British America. I am always on the lookout for stamps and covers with postmarks from communities in Queens County, Nova Scotia. I do list various goods including stamps occasionally on eBay as hdm50
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Post by hdm1950 on Sept 15, 2024 21:50:51 GMT
doug534 a thought that just struck me is that these stamps could have been supplied to the company that did the perfin in coil form and that there may have been a splice resulting in the 2 ply situation.
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doug534
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Post by doug534 on Sept 15, 2024 23:10:00 GMT
clovermite appears correct in assigning the perfin to Douwe Egberts. The listing of Netherlands perfins at www.stampsoftheworld.co.uk/wiki/Netherlands_Perfins has it catalogued as "DE2" and states the pattern "D.E." was used by the company from 1927 to 1982. No information on the backing material present on my stamp is presented. |
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rod222
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Post by rod222 on Sept 16, 2024 3:08:09 GMT
Quote I'm pretty sure D.E. means Douwe Egberts,I can intimately agree with that assumption, From peer pressure, and lack of health knowledge at the time I smoked cigarettes from "DRUM" tobacco, during my naval apprenticeship 15yo-20yo before giving up smoking for good. As I recall, it was a very nice blend. (And a very tough habit to kick)  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2024 9:01:39 GMT
Quote I'm pretty sure D.E. means Douwe Egberts,I can intimately agree with that assumption, From peer pressure, and lack of health knowledge at the time I smoked cigarettes from "DRUM" tobacco, during my naval apprenticeship 15yo-20yo before giving up smoking for good. As I recall, it was a very nice blend. (And a very tough habit to kick) I don't get it. |
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rod222
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Post by rod222 on Sept 16, 2024 9:45:19 GMT
Drum is a Dutch brand of fine-cut handrolling tobacco, or shag, introduced in 1952.
It was originally produced and distributed by the Douwe Egberts corporation.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2024 9:58:55 GMT
Drum is a Dutch brand of fine-cut handrolling tobacco, or shag, introduced in 1952. It was originally produced and distributed by the Douwe Egberts corporation. Oh, you should have mentioned. I thought that, but it seemed pretty random. |
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stanley64
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Post by stanley64 on Sept 16, 2024 10:00:36 GMT
Did I goof by removing the backing?    As far as the perfin goes, I think no fault was made, but must admit it is a bit of curiosity as to the origins of the second bit of paper. For the D.E. perfin itself, my references show two with these initials: " Disconto- en Effectenbank" & " Douwe Egberts Tabaksfabriek, Koffiebranderijen, Theehandel N.V." This one, of which there are 3 examples known, is from those used by Douwe Egberts, as already pointed out and given the single dot of the middle bar of the "E" with this one from their Utrecht office (1928 - 1976).
A bit of 'perfin' fun with a cup of tea close at hand...
Have fun and happy collecting!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2024 12:29:33 GMT
Whatever it is, I would keep it with the stamp, in case it ever definitively is identified, at least you'll still have it.
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Post by bobcat126 on Sept 16, 2024 18:55:55 GMT
I'm guessing here...but could the bit of paper backing be a paste-up? Or does that only apply to coils? I'm probably wrong and apologize in advance
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hdm1950
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Posts: 1,886
What I collect: I collect world wide up to 1965 with several specialty albums added due to volume of material I have acquired. At this point I am focused on Canada and British America. I am always on the lookout for stamps and covers with postmarks from communities in Queens County, Nova Scotia. I do list various goods including stamps occasionally on eBay as hdm50
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Post by hdm1950 on Sept 16, 2024 19:52:55 GMT
I'm guessing here...but could the bit of paper backing be a paste-up? Or does that only apply to coils? I'm probably wrong and apologize in advance That was the conclusion I came up with. I thinking that the stamps would be fed through the perfin device in strips and would be pasted/spliced like coil stamps. Hopefully a specialist in stamps of the Netherlands will have an answer. |
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doug534
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Post by doug534 on Sept 16, 2024 20:39:07 GMT
Well, that Netherlands 10c perfin punched "D.E." (Scott # 304, issued in 1948) is now part of a Netherlands 1872-1954 issues lot that I just placed on eBay as an auction item. I am selling as "TanglewoodStamps" and am learning that putting items on eBay is a very challenging way to deal with my Dad's philatelic materials. My wife tells me that, if it sells, I will be paying myself about half a cent an hour. But I am enjoying the journey and can only wonder what my Dad would think. Thanks for all the help from you forum folks. The Stamp Forum is a great educational tool.
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Post by bobcat126 on Sept 17, 2024 16:52:38 GMT
hdm1950 that's a good conclusion, and it sounds logical to me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2024 11:36:45 GMT
Dutch perfins in my collection. T. = Turkenburg's Zaadhandel N.V.  Triangle = Zuid Hollandische Bierbrouwerij N.V.  |
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stanley64
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Post by stanley64 on Sept 26, 2024 7:36:19 GMT
Wonderful @clovermite and thanks for the showing; I especially like the triangle from 'Zuid Hollandische Bierbrouwerij N.V.' with its syncopated or roltanding perfs.
Here is some additional information for each of the two perfins shown:
‘T’ : Bodegraven, Turkenburg's Zaadhandel N.V. (1930 - 1971)
‘Triangle’ : Gravenhage, N.V. Zuid-Hollandsche Bierbrouwerij (1926 – 1931)
At the same time, here are few examples from my own collection of perfins found on the Queen Wilhelmina ('Veth' Type) with syncopated or roltanding perforations, 
‘JA/M’ : unknown
‘RK/H’ Amsterdam, Rhodius-Koenigs Handel-Maatschappij (1923 – 1937)
‘HP’ Gravenhage, Haagsche Post, weekblad (1922 - 1930)
If anyone can assist with identification of the '‘JA/M’ perfin, it would be appreciated...
Have fun and happy collecting!
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franoise
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Post by franoise on Sept 26, 2024 7:53:25 GMT
AL/M : Amsterdamsche Ledermaatschappij (1926-44)
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stanley64
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Post by stanley64 on Sept 26, 2024 8:24:39 GMT
Thanks for the prompt reply franoise ; it is appreicated and my notes have been updated. Once again, bitten by the dyslexia bug ;-) In the meantime, I did find this tp provide historical context,
Have fun and happy collecting!
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