polarbear
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What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 8, 2020 2:35:40 GMT
Hi everyone. This is my umpteenth time trying to create this post. I’ve been having difficulty with images - both quality and uploading. Please bear with me. I don’t have access to a scanner right now. I would appreciate any help I could get with these stamps. Where is this stamp from? USSR?
are these Russian? They don’t have the usual CCCP markings.
The first on the top row is from Lithuania right? I have no idea where Bohmen and Mahren are and a Google search didn’t help. The second one on the bottom says Sahara O.C.C. R.A.S.D., which I think is Morocco. And the last one is a French stamp from when the French occupied the south of Italy during WW 2, if I’m correct?
and finally, what IS this item? A stamp? A cinderella?
Thanks for looking everyone. I can’t find the last stamp place using Google either. 😕
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polarbear
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Posts: 585
What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 8, 2020 2:51:25 GMT
Okay, some of the stamps I thought were Russian are, but they are from the Imperial era from 1858-1888. Still looking for the other stamps.
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wakeybluenose
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What I collect: GB to 2000 (but definitives to date) / Ireland to 2000 / General WW classics & definitives / ASFEC / SciFi & Fantasy Literature / Local History
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Post by wakeybluenose on Dec 8, 2020 2:56:50 GMT
The last one is from Estonia
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 8, 2020 3:02:40 GMT
The first on the top row is from Lithuania right? I have no idea where Bohmen and Mahren are and a Google search didn’t help. The second one on the bottom says Sahara O.C.C. R.A.S.D., which I think is Morocco. And the last one is a French stamp from when the French occupied the south of Italy during WW 2, if I’m correct?
Row 1: Lithuania Row 2: Bohemia and Moravia (Czechoslovakia), Western Sahara (considered by some to be a bogus stamp), 1946 French occupation of Fezzan-Ghadamès (part of modern Libya)
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polarbear
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Posts: 585
What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 8, 2020 4:36:03 GMT
Well I kinda got them right! Though Italy and Libya are quite a distance apart! 😀 Thanks for the quick response.
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 8, 2020 5:15:32 GMT
Well I kinda got them right! Though Italy and Libya are quite a distance apart! 😀 Thanks for the quick response. Actually, not far off. Libya is south of Italy, and was still an Italian colony at the beginning of WWII. Free French forces occupied by the end of WWII, so these are considered French occupation stamp of Libya (at least by Scott, anyway). For more accurate and detailed info on the history at that time in relationship to the stamp, you can check out Michael's Fezzan-Ghadamès.
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hrdoktorx
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What I collect: France (and French territories), Africa, Canada, USA, Germany, Guatemala, stamps about science, flags, maps, stamps on stamps...
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Post by hrdoktorx on Dec 8, 2020 7:17:42 GMT
The first stamp is from the R.S.F.S.R (Russian Socialist Federation of Soviet Republics, I think it means). This is from the period 1917-1920 after the Bolchevik Revolution but before the Soviet Union was formally established. The 40P overprint is an overprint of a tsarist Russian stamp in the early Revolution and Russian civil war era. The other ones with the eagle design are tsarist Russia issues (i.e. pre-1917). I'm not an expert in this area so I'll defer to more knowledgeable members for exact identification.
Bohemia and Moravia (Böhmen und Mähren) was the German puppet state installed in Czechoslovakia during their Occupation in 1939-1945.
Fezzan and Ghadamès correspond to Western Libya, and were indeed the parts of that then-Italian possession that the Free French Forces invaded during World War II from Algeria/Tunisia in the West and Chad in the South. Fezzan has some beautiful designs and is one of my favourites countries, but difficult to find!
Identifying Western Sahara (RASD = République Arabe Saharaouie Démocratique) with Morocco is as insulting to some as misidentifying Catalonia for Spain! Western Sahara has been in the throes of a civil war of independence from Morocco since Spain pulled out in 1976 (after Franco's death) and gave the territory to the Cherifian monarchy, while a significant portion of the local population wanted outright independence and formed the Polisario front that has been fighting the Moroccan army ever since, with the support of Algeria (and, for a time, Mauritania as well). This conflict flared up again a few weeks ago, actually. The RASD has not yet been formally recognized internationally, though, so the RASD stamps were more a public relations effort to get the country noticed, and I've only seen them as mint or CTOs, with no real postal usage, so most catalogs do not mention them. The UN has resolved for an independence referendum to be held, but Morocco has always refused (or demanded that all Morrocans, not just the Saharaouis, take part in the referendum, to ensure annexation would win). This resistance to the referendum is what got Morrocco kicked out of the African Union.
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vikingeck
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What I collect: Samoa, Tobacco theme, Mail in Wartime, anything odd and unusual!
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Post by vikingeck on Dec 8, 2020 10:44:46 GMT
Okay, some of the stamps I thought were Russian are, but they are from the Imperial era from 1858-1888. Still looking for the other stamps. Just in case some similar stamps turn up with small rings or circles in the design and with currency not in kopecks but in penni they are from Finland which was a Grand Duchy of Russia in the Tsarist times .
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polarbear
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What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 8, 2020 12:21:15 GMT
Identifying Western Sahara (RASD = République Arabe Saharaouie Démocratique) with Morocco is as insulting to some as misidentifying Catalonia for Spain! Western Sahara has been in the throes of a civil war of independence from Morocco since Spain pulled out in 1976 (after Franco's death) and gave the territory to the Cherifian monarchy, while a significant portion of the local population wanted outright independence and formed the Polisario front that has been fighting the Moroccan army ever since, with the support of Algeria (and, for a time, Mauritania as well). This conflict flared up again a few weeks ago, actually. The RASD has not yet been formally recognized internationally, though, so the RASD stamps were more a public relations effort to get the country noticed, and I've only seen them as mint or CTOs, with no real postal usage, so most catalogs do not mention them. The UN has resolved for an independence referendum to be held, but Morocco has always refused (or demanded that all Morrocans, not just the Saharaouis, take part in the referendum, to ensure annexation would win). This resistance to the referendum is what got Morrocco kicked out of the African Union. Wow! Thanks for all this background! I had no idea of the history. I just googled West Sahara occ RASD. My guess is this stamp has been in my collection a long time. I certainly don’t remember buying it. I haven’t purchased world wide stamps for many years. Maybe a decade or more. Thanks, khj and wakeybluenose and hrdoktorx for the history lesson! 🙂
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polarbear
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Posts: 585
What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 8, 2020 15:30:38 GMT
On further research the stamps I thought were Russian are a mix of the ones hrdoktorx mentioned and some Estonian ones. I can’t find some of them on StampWorld’s online catalogue though, so I’m not sure. The word Mapka around the central medallion was my clue. Anyone out there specialize in that part of the world of stamps that could give some input?
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hrdoktorx
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What I collect: France (and French territories), Africa, Canada, USA, Germany, Guatemala, stamps about science, flags, maps, stamps on stamps...
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Post by hrdoktorx on Dec 8, 2020 17:15:58 GMT
As vikingeck said, the "Marka" currency is a hint of Finland. This was their currency before the Euro.
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 8, 2020 17:30:23 GMT
Okay, some of the stamps I thought were Russian are, but they are from the Imperial era from 1858-1888. Still looking for the other stamps. Just in case some similar stamps turn up with small rings or circles in the design and with currency not in kopecks but in penni they are from Finland which was a Grand Duchy of Russia in the Tsarist times . Just to clarify, the small rings/circles added on the Finnish stamp only appear on the Finnish kopeck/ruble issues to distinguish them from the Russian issues that are in kopeck/ruble issues. The similar Finnish stamps in penni/markka currency do not have the small rings/circles added, because they are distinguished from the Russian issues by virtue of different currency. As vikingdeck alluded to, the stamps you have are not Finnish issues. But do keep a eye out for them as he pointed out, as they are less common than the Russian counterparts. On more than one occasion, I actually found some of the Finnish Grand Duchy kopeck/ruble issues in batches/pages of Russian stamps!
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 8, 2020 17:38:21 GMT
On further research the stamps I thought were Russian are a mix of the ones hrdoktorx mentioned and some Estonian ones. I can’t find some of them on StampWorld’s online catalogue though, so I’m not sure. The word Mapka around the central medallion was my clue. Anyone out there specialize in that part of the world of stamps that could give some input? There are numerous sites to help identify a stamp by country/area, but not many of them are truly illustrated. You can do some googling for stamp identifier, but avoid the "catalog" sites if you are simply first trying to find out the country/area. For the Russian area issues, the Scott catalog does have a basic illustrated identifier section (about 2 pages covering the Russia area). Linn's had it available online for downloading at one time, but I can no longer find the link. Maybe someone else has the link. Since Linn's had it available online, I assume it is public domain. If you are interested, I can email it to you. However, it is from last decade. They upgraded the identifier since then, but I can only email you the one that I believe is in public domain. Send me a PM if interested.
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bobstew617
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What I collect: Switzerland, Ireland, Scandinavia, Channel Islands, Hong Kong (British Admin), PNG, others...
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Post by bobstew617 on Dec 8, 2020 22:59:06 GMT
yes! other members are dealing with this question. I collect Finland, but not Russia, so this is good information.
Thanks for sharing this out on the forum!
BOB
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 8, 2020 23:34:17 GMT
Ah yes, the Finland serpentines are to die for! Once I saw them, I ended up not only jumping into Finland 15 years ago, but dug into Scandinavia. Technically I still collect WW, but my desk has been surrounded by Sweden and the other Scandinavian areas for the past 5 years.
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philatelia
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Captain Jack - my best kiloware find ever!
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What I collect: Ireland, Japan, Scandy, USA, Venezuela, Vatican, Bermuda, Austria
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Post by philatelia on Dec 9, 2020 23:22:38 GMT
Yes! I’m hooked on those Finland Serpentines, too! I have a bunch of new purchases that I haven’t yet had time to study.
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Ryan
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Calgary, Alberta, Canada
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What I collect: If I have a catalogue for it, I collect it. And I have many catalogues ....
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Post by Ryan on Dec 11, 2020 2:33:30 GMT
On further research the stamps I thought were Russian are a mix of the ones hrdoktorx mentioned and some Estonian ones. I can’t find some of them on StampWorld’s online catalogue though, so I’m not sure. The word Mapka around the central medallion was my clue. Anyone out there specialize in that part of the world of stamps that could give some input? The Estonian language is closely related to Finnish. Their currency names are similar but not exactly the same. On old Estonian stamps (1919-1928), you have 1 mark / 2 marka (and penni for smaller amounts, like our cents), whereas on Finnish stamps you'll see 1 markka / 2 markkaa (and penniä for smaller amounts). After 1928, Estonia called their currency the kroon, and eventually like Finland they moved to the Euro. A more certain way of identifying Estonian stamps comes from finding "Eesti" somewhere on the stamp. There are some low-priced occupation stamps you might see where you also see the German name "Estland" on the stamp. Ryan (who is 1/4 Estonian ...)
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polarbear
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What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 11, 2020 11:51:41 GMT
Thanks Ryan . I have become woefully aware of how ignorant I am of that part of Europe and its history during this exercise. Also the various currencies.
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philatelia
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Captain Jack - my best kiloware find ever!
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What I collect: Ireland, Japan, Scandy, USA, Venezuela, Vatican, Bermuda, Austria
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Post by philatelia on Dec 11, 2020 14:32:54 GMT
polarbear , hun, compared to the general population here in the USA, as a stamp collector, your knowledge of geography easily places you ahead of 95% of most Americans! You go, girl! LoL if you were to ask many Americans “What is Estonia?” in a multi choices quiz, they would probably pick “a marijuana shop in Colorado.” Hahaha!
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kasvik
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What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
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Post by kasvik on Dec 11, 2020 14:50:04 GMT
Identifying Western Sahara (RASD = République Arabe Saharaouie Démocratique) with Morocco Wow! Thanks for all this background! I had no idea of the history. I just googled West Sahara occ RASD. My guess is this stamp has been in my collection a long time. I certainly don’t remember buying it. I haven’t purchased world wide stamps for many years. Maybe a decade or more. Thanks, khj and wakeybluenose and hrdoktorx for the history lesson! 🙂 polarbear , maybe you were on to something. Yesterday's headline: Israel, Morocco to normalize ties; US shifts W Sahara policy. Lousy day for the Polisario Front.
Like Harold Wilson almost said sixty-five years ago, 'A week is a long time in stamp collecting'.
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polarbear
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Posts: 585
What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 11, 2020 15:08:53 GMT
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polarbear
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Posts: 585
What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 11, 2020 15:16:19 GMT
@kasvik I sure waded into deep water on that subject, didn’t I?! Seems like it’s a no-win situation over there no matter what anyone does!
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 12, 2020 3:59:51 GMT
LoL if you were to ask many Americans “What is Estonia?” in a multi choices quiz, they would probably pick “a marijuana shop in Colorado.” Hahaha! We're so US-centric, too. I always get it wrong when I reply Tbilisi to the question "What is the capital of Georgia?"
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polarbear
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Posts: 585
What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 18, 2020 15:58:15 GMT
Hi everyone. I have another question. I found these “stamps” in my Canada collection to be sorted. I sort by face value first. As you can imagine, I had difficulty with these! What are they and what year? Are these cinderellas? Or did they really not print a face value on these? Can’t find them in Unitrade.
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 18, 2020 17:55:07 GMT
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polarbear
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Posts: 585
What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 18, 2020 22:43:45 GMT
Thanks khj. I didn’t know how to delete this post.
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 18, 2020 23:51:43 GMT
Thanks khj . I didn’t know how to delete this post. In the future, if you want to delete a post, you can click on the gear icon at the top right of your post. There should be a "Delete Post" option between "Report Post" and "Member". I believe there is a time limit regarding deleting/editing posts, but not sure what is the current time limit. If you don't see the "Delete Post" option in the drop-down, that means it's already past the time limit. But don't delete it this time, because then my post looks strange.
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polarbear
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What I collect: Canada Used to 2015, revenues, perfins. Newfoundland, St. Pierre & Miquelon, Worldwide textiles/handwork and Christmas.
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Post by polarbear on Dec 19, 2020 2:13:11 GMT
Okay, gotcha. I tried the gear and there was nothing but bookmark there. Guess I missed the timeframe.
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khj
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Post by khj on Dec 19, 2020 4:44:34 GMT
Sorry, I meant the gear for your old post, not the current post you are typing. You are correct, there is only "Bookmark" if you haven't submitted the current post you are typing.
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