cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Mar 21, 2021 16:27:20 GMT
From Camberg/Nassau to Frankfurt/Main / June 22, 1948 Michel # 937 (3*100 Pfennige = 300 Pfennige) Michel # 950 (2*20 Pfennige = 40 Pfennige) Michel # 962 (1*500 Pfennige = 500 Pfennige) Total 840/10 = 84 Pfennige = correct postage (registered mail) Michel # 950 with margins and a complete "HAN" ("Hausauftragsnummer"). The HAN 4131.46 2 is listed in Michel Germany special. The HAN is a sequence of digits on German stamps produced by plate printing, printed on the margins of the sheet and identical to the numerical record made by the printer of the print orders placed in the respective fiscal year.
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Mar 23, 2021 21:42:13 GMT
From Birkenwerder ( Russian zone) to Bremen / June 29, 1948 Michel # 962 (500 Pfennige) 500 / 10 = 50 Pfennige Michel # 174 (24 Pfennige) <- district overprint Berlin (#3)Michel # I b (2*5 Pfennige = 10 Pfennige) <- district overprint Birkenwerder near Berlin (#36)Total 84 Pfennige = correct postage (registered mail) District overprints: Currency conversion period starts in the Russian zone on June 24, 1948. Old stamps could be used up with 1/10 of their nominal value. Stamps with new currency should be available with overprints on the so-called "1. und 2. Kontrollratsausgabe" (Maschinenaufdrucke - "Sowjetische Besatzungszone"), but they could not be obtained so quickly. Temporarily, the district overprints served as a substitute and had a validity from June 24, 1948 to July 10, 1948 (18 days). Most of these overprints are forgeries. The cover is signed with "Heweker BPP". Nevertheless, it cannot be ruled out that the overprints are false, since so-called "old signatures" (eg Heweker) do not offer any certainty of authenticity according to today's research results. If I wanted to sell the letter, it would have to be signed again. cara
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Mar 26, 2021 20:01:07 GMT
From Munich to ? / June 23, 1948 - 9am Michel # 911 (5*1 Pfennige = 5 Pfennige) Michel # 921 (5*15 Pfennige = 75 Pfennige) Michel # 962 (2*500 Pfennige = 1000 Pfennige) Total 1080/10 = 108 Pfennige = correct postage (registered mail 21 to 50 grams) It is not a very nice envelope ... ... but it is interesting and shows the lack of resources in post-war Germany: The envelope was used twice. Unfortunately, one can not decipher the postmark on the back, but it could be stamps from inflation 1923. From Radebeul (Sovjet-zone) to Dresden / June 30, 1948 Michel # 947 (10*12 Pfennige = 120 Pfennige) Total 120/10 = 12 Pfennige = correct postage (postcard) No special stamps, no special cover ... But an interesting cancellation " Achtet auf den Kartoffelkäfer" (watch out for the potato beetle). Food was very scarce. cara
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kasvik
Member
Posts: 543
What I collect: Cancels mostly, especially Sweden Gävle and Lidingö, Switzerland Geneva, Germany Pforzheim
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Post by kasvik on Jul 7, 2021 1:35:35 GMT
This was 2 Euros on Delcampe. From 19 March 1946, it is not a philatelic gem, but a nostalgic one.
The business, in Pforzheim, closed about twenty years ago. I bought a suit there once, for an unexpected funeral. Emil Moser, 1876-1960, was an assimilated Jew. His business was closed in 1935, but he seems to have been relatively unmolested. But that couldn’t last after the SS took over everything. He was deported, with his brother Julius, a decorated World War One veteran. On 17 February 1945 they were sent to Theresienstadt—the ‘model’ concentration camp. Six days later massive British firebombing completely destroyed Pforzheim, including his former shop. The Moser brothers endured hideous treatment in Theresienstadt. Another brother and their sister did not survive the Holocaust.
But here is Emil, one year later back in business. The occupying Americans put his brother in charge of the local Chamber of Commerce!
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REL1948
Member
Posts: 583
What I collect: 1840-Pre-Decimal, GB and Colonies, 1840 1 penny reds, Postal Histories
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Post by REL1948 on Jul 7, 2021 2:00:47 GMT
kasvik What a fascinating tie in of events. Your involvement makes it a great story. Thank you for sharing. Rob
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Aug 18, 2021 21:53:19 GMT
One of my favorite envelopes. The blue pigeon (Blaue Taube) 5 DM postage due as single franking. Only possible as insured letter and as insured letter with express. Sealed on the back. There should not be many postage due covers with this franking, therefore Michel rates these covers accordingly. Michel # 962 from Wuppertal to Kiel May 31, 1948. Cover with 485 grams: 80 Pfennige Insurance 6,000 DM: 340 Pfennige Express: 80 Pfennige In total: 500 Pfennige = 5 DMCara
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JeffS
Member
Posts: 2,604
What I collect: Oranges Philately, US Slogan Cancels, Cape of Good Hope Triangulars, and Texas poster stamps and cinderellas
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Post by JeffS on Aug 18, 2021 22:48:39 GMT
cara A lovely and rare single franking. I don't understand where postage due comes into play. Please explain.
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Aug 19, 2021 6:42:27 GMT
cara A lovely and rare single franking. I don't understand where postage due comes into play. Please explain. JeffS sorry maybe I used not the correct English words. The 5 DM was the exact postage for that letter. The question arises why a 5 DM stamp was issued at all, because at that time it was not a usual franking, but only in very rare exceptional cases the postage was exactly 5 DM.
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Mar 13, 2022 16:14:28 GMT
gstamps here I show some envelopes with postmark "Gebühr bezahlt". After the end of World War II, efforts were made to resume postal traffic in Germany as quickly as possible. Because the use of stamps of the Third Reich was prohibited and stamps were not available in sufficient quantity, many letters were provided with so-called cash frankings (Gebühr bezahlt). Michel distinguishes essentially by type of postmark - handwritten cash franking - single-line postmark with and without frame - two-line postmark with and without frame - postmark with value indication - circle postmark - oval postmark as well as different font types, colors, upper and lower case, special characters etc. Cash frankings existed in all zones of Germany. Relatively common in 1945 but common at least until 1950. To my knowledge, there was no specific period of use. Examples: Cara
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Mar 13, 2022 16:17:54 GMT
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Post by gstamps on Apr 2, 2022 7:44:24 GMT
Thank you cara. Sorry for the delay in thanking you, but I think my request was in the 'West Berlin' thread and the administrator opened a new sub-thread in DDR and I gave up with posting the Berlin-Brandenburg stamps. Very educational (for me at least) all the comments about the stamps on the envelopes. Reading your comments and explanations, many unknowns were cleared up for me. I have recently purchased some blocks of 4 stamps (21 June 1948/ Mi#36-51) with "Band and Netzaufdruck. The block Mi #38I has the Druckerzeichen(DZ),7 positive marking on the edge which is not mentioned in the catalogue (only 1 positive) The original stamp Mi#945 has DZ 7 positive. The overprint looks fine to me. There is also the possibility that the overprint is fake and the forger printed it on a sheet with the wrong DZ. ...or the information that the sheet with DZ 7 was also used is not yet found and mentioned in the Michel catalogue. For clarification I need your help to know if the overprint is fake or genuine (I am not going to send it for certification).
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Apr 2, 2022 8:47:46 GMT
Hi gstamps , a nice set of blocks you purchased 😊 To answer your question, I believe that the „7“ is not a DZ, but a plate number. If you look at my post with the DZ you can see that the number itself is of white colour and the colour of the stamp (in your example orange) is around the number. That could be the reason why you can not find the DZ 7 for #945 in the Michel catalogue. Regarding the overprint I will tell you a little story: Some years ago I visited the Munich stamp fair. A friend of mine bought such a block with overprint (Bandaufdruck) from a well-known stamp-dealer, provided that he has the stamp checked immediately at the BPP booth and that the overprint is genuine. So we went to the BPP booth very sure that the imprint is genuine and met Andreas Schlegel, one of the most famous stamp examiners in Germany. He took his rather small magnifying glass, one look … forgery! We asked him why and he told us „wrong angle of the imprint, wrong stamp ink“ and a third criteria I can’t remember. Se we were a bit disappointed and went back to the stamp-dealer. In my opinion he was not really surprised, payed back the 200 EUR and put the stamp back into his stockbook! So lessons learned: - I’am definitely not an expert of Band- und Netzaufdrucke - be carefully even the stamp-dealer is well-known and has a good reputation - I will only buy Band- und Netzaufdrucke with an attestation (if the price exceeds 50 EUR) So I wish you good luck that your imprint is genuine. You will only have certainty if you have the imprint checked by Schlegel or another BPP-inspector. Cara
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JeffS
Member
Posts: 2,604
What I collect: Oranges Philately, US Slogan Cancels, Cape of Good Hope Triangulars, and Texas poster stamps and cinderellas
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Post by JeffS on Apr 2, 2022 9:20:29 GMT
cara What about the overprint set-off on the reverse?
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bobstew617
Member
Posts: 376
What I collect: Switzerland, Ireland, Scandinavia, Channel Islands, Hong Kong (British Admin), PNG, others...
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Post by bobstew617 on Apr 2, 2022 12:29:54 GMT
cara, THANK YOU for sharing these! I collect West Berlin, and I find this era fascinating. I especially find it interesting to see how many stamps franked some of these covers!!
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Post by gstamps on Apr 2, 2022 13:17:06 GMT
Thank you, caraFunny story about Schlegel.I'm sure he didn't forget the third reason. I got some advice on ink,the small variations of the postal horn,the angle between the left lightning bolt and the horn,the overprint not being off set or done on the computer printer. Not much help. And yet there's something else...it surprises me how one person seeing pictures of my blocks tells me they are possibly genuine.(it's an obvious observable reason that doesn't necessarily require having the stamp in front of your eyes). At the time I was getting a response on a site about these overprints, that person said they stop so that the scoundrels (I suspect they meant forgers) don't even find out all the clues that expose them. I also have a Mi#40I block with DZ 2 negative.In the catalogue it says that the DZ marking is found to the left/ right of fields 1/11, 10/20, 81/91 or 90/100. Another Mi#47II block with a more visible set off. (As JeffS saw well)
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Apr 4, 2022 6:27:29 GMT
JeffS According to Michel special overprint set-off on the reverse exists for these stamps, but I do not have an example. bobstew617 I will have a look. I think I have some covers with these overprints and I will show them.
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Post by gstamps on Apr 4, 2022 8:46:47 GMT
I present 2 more Mi41II and Mi43II blocks that have genuine overprints. Both blocks show a II AF P I variety which is mentioned in the catalogue. I can't translate. cara can you help me. Thanks
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Apr 4, 2022 10:42:21 GMT
gstamps: II AF P I means: The loop of the post horn is distorted. The distance between this post horn and the post horn above and below is larger than normally. I do not understand the addition in brackets either ("1., 4. und 8. Markenreiche" )
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Post by PostmasterGS on Apr 4, 2022 11:27:34 GMT
I do not understand the addition in brackets either ("1., 4. und 8. Markenreiche" ) That’s a typo. It should be “1., 4. Und 8. Markenreihe”, meaning stamp rows 1, 4, and 8.
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Post by gstamps on Apr 4, 2022 11:29:43 GMT
Thanks cara. This is where I had problems too. Could it be the row number on the sheet? A Mi 45I block rated photo as genuine (not by expert)
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Post by gstamps on Apr 4, 2022 11:35:47 GMT
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Post by gstamps on Apr 4, 2022 18:27:50 GMT
Together with the batch of 4 blocks with overprint there were also some stamps from other series, also from the German occupation period. It is Scott 654 and according to the Scott catalogue it is easy to identify (3 perforations 11, 11 ½ x11 ,14 and watermark 286) Identification becomes more complicated-and interesting-if you use Michel's specialized catalog: - 6 drawing types (I, Ia, II, IIa, III, IIIa and IV)-use mobile phone for magnification and observation of fine details, -5 types of perforations (A, B, D, E and G)-see catalogue page for details. -2 types of watermark (X and W) Surprisingly for me, identification went very easily. With the naked eye (I don't use an odometer) it is the perforation in line L14 (the perforation K14 x 14 ¼ is easily recognizable with the hole in the corners of the stamp perfectly aligned with the holes on the horizontal and vertical). We are down to just two stamp variations-see the arrows on the catalog page. WOW!!! one of the variants has a catalogue value of 1700 Euro. I had no luck - it's watermark type W ( 3 Euro) Maybe in your collection you have the stamp with watermark type X? Good luck.
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cara
Member
Posts: 198
What I collect: Germany (FRG, GDR, Berlin); occupied Germany 1945-1949, Deutsches Reich 1872-1945, Switzerland, USA (newbie)
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Post by cara on Apr 4, 2022 21:50:15 GMT
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Post by gstamps on Apr 14, 2022 10:47:46 GMT
I always try to identify the stamps in this series (in the specialized Michel catalog there are variants with high values - of course only with BPP certification) Today I identified Scott 651 (Michel 90): It is immediately noticeable that it has a perforation K14x14 ¼. The watermark is of type W (I presented it in the previous post) There are 3 possible variants in the catalog: Here comes a more difficult criterion to identify - drawing variants II, III or IV. And I'm not lucky - my stamp is III or IV. (3 colored lines on the portal - see the arrow on the picture) If your stamps meet the above criteria and have drawing version II (4 lines-see arrow) it is worth sending it to BPP for certification Success
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Post by gstamps on May 30, 2022 8:05:09 GMT
Two more stamps from this series, Mi 98 and 99 (Scott 659 and 660), both type II. In the Michel catalog are presented the 2 types I and II. Type I has 3 subtypes (Ia, Ib and Ic) with 3, 5 and 7 dashes in the archway Type I : -without vertical lines in the cornices of the right tower -4 dashes in the archway (short flight of stairs) Type II : -with vertical lines in the cornices of the right tower -7 dashes in the archway (height flight of stairs) Below are the 2 types of the Mi 99 (Scott 660) stamp. edit:I am sorry.Both stamps are type IIThere are also 3 varieties of high value, with Z watermark or with D and P perforations. I hope you will identify them in your collections and post them here.
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salentin
Member
collecting Germany,where I live and about 20 more countries,half of them in Asia east of the Indus
Posts: 5,619
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Post by salentin on May 30, 2022 12:46:14 GMT
I may be wrong,but to me both 3 DM stamps side by side look like type II.
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Post by paul1 on May 30, 2022 14:06:15 GMT
think I'm discovering it's not easy to post pix of stamps that either haven't been posted before, or only rarely. So, apologies for yet more Civil Government values issued during the allied occupation in the immediate post war period - my only excuse for adding more is the colour difference and I'm very dim on Europe because I stick to The Commonwealth, usually;-);-). These three popped up in a boot sale acquisition recently. I could be very wrong, but judging by my ancient SG catalogue originally it seems there were perhaps as many as 23 or 24 values - all in Pfennigs and in a choice of fruity looking colours - it alos appears that used are possibly more valuable than mint. I was fortunate in that the old album in which these appeared also included the information slips as per the picture, which helped me to id the stamps. Anyway, having only returned recently to this hobby I'm definitely a beginner but thought I'd pick one or two of what I imagined might be the more interesting bits for show.
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Post by gstamps on May 30, 2022 15:18:11 GMT
salentin, with my myopia of 6 something like this happens to me. I'm sorry. I'll try to change the picture. I was trying to present two plate flaws and I confused the pictures. PF VI = C and H joined up with a white line PF X = white spot under the window.
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sudbury12000
Member
Posts: 315
What I collect: Canada, Great Britain, Germany, World Pre 1925
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Post by sudbury12000 on Mar 5, 2024 15:51:17 GMT
I think this is the correct thread. Found this in a large collection that I purchased last month. Still going through! Never seen a gutter pair on this issue, be more fun it was used! I noticed a fleck on the white middle, anyone else seen this?
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cursus
Member
Posts: 1,770
What I collect: Catalan Cinderellas. Used Switzerland, UK, Scandinavia, Germany & Austria. Postal History of Barcelona & Estonia. Catalonia pictorial postmarks.
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Post by cursus on Mar 5, 2024 17:39:02 GMT
This is not a "tete-beche". Where do you see the inverted stamp? But, there's a shift of the red ink.
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