Poodle_Mum
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Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Jan 30, 2018 0:09:41 GMT
There is a big question mark on one of the shilling forgeries. I've not yet found the error that identifies it as a forgery and it could very well be a reprint. I've got a good magnification system now so I'll be able to investigate it more to find an extended line or error in the numerals.
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Post by dgdecker on Jan 30, 2018 1:02:50 GMT
Wow! Now I really need to get cracking and get my collection mounted.
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Jan 30, 2018 1:15:39 GMT
I'm in the midst of creating my own pages and using my Scott Junior International Albums to make a personal edition of Big Blue so one day these will be nicely mounted. Since I'm making light background quadrille pages with only the country information at the top as is common in Scott Albums, these will be penciled with the appropriate information as well as certificates.
I also have a nice 3 pence on cover with attached letter.
It would be nice to have a few more varieties of #13 but I'm tapped out and there will be another time in the future to do that.
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Jan 30, 2018 1:21:32 GMT
I'd love to see your collection. Please scan them or take a picture of them for us.
The greatest thing about every issue of NS is that there are quite a few colour varieties, even within the limited Unitrade examples. Every one of my 3p are a colour variety.
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judith
Member
currently everything and anything up to 1968
Posts: 121
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Post by judith on Jan 30, 2018 2:31:27 GMT
Beautiful! What a great collection -- I'm deep olive green with envy.
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Jan 30, 2018 4:23:08 GMT
It was a labour of love and sacrifice to create this collection. Perhaps one day I'll come across the Scott #7 shilling. I'll start saving my nickels (we don't have pennies in Canada anymore) and one day I might actually find one. The hardest two to find were the 6 pence yellow green and the shilling. I've never seen the other shilling ever come up - I did however have the opportunity to see one in the postal museum in 2015. I waited for years to finally see the #6 shilling come up and the 6 pence yellow green is really hard to find. Likewise with #13 colour varieties. I recently saw a listing for them from my dealer but all tapped out so I'll have to wait and save some dough for the next time varieties of #13 become available. Finding colour varieties of that one are very difficult or they are in really bad shape.
It's normal to find the cent issues off centre but I don't want ones that are missing perfs, tears or too dirty to know if it's a colour variety or just needs a nice bath.
Well despite the odds I intend to be around for a long time so there's plenty of time to find them.
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 5, 2018 6:02:08 GMT
David here is the current state of my NS.Somewhere in the to do pile I have a couple greens that I was trying to decide proper catalog number. Very nice colour varieties in the cent issues particularly #9 and #13. Your 2p is a reprint or forgery with a genuine cancel. Beautiful margins on it.
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firstfrog2013
Member
Posts: 3,276
What I collect: BNA Liberia St Pierre U.S. Bolivia Turkey
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Post by firstfrog2013 on Feb 5, 2018 18:55:07 GMT
Poodle Mum I have a couple more pence issues on the way I'll need your opinion on them.
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 6, 2018 1:37:48 GMT
I'll do my best Mr. Frog 😁
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Beryllium Guy
Moderator
Posts: 5,654
What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Feb 8, 2018 6:59:52 GMT
As I promised on the "Watcha Been Stamping?" thread, now that I am back home, here is a scan of my only NS pence issue. As I mentioned before, this stamp is in very poor condition, having been torn into two pieces at some point, and then crudely put back together using an old stamp hinge. Kelly ( Poodle_Mum ), I am interested to know your opinion if you can tell from this scan if the stamp appears genuine to you. Thanks!
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 8, 2018 8:55:58 GMT
What colour is the back of the stamp and how thick is the paper?
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Beryllium Guy
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What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Feb 8, 2018 16:08:42 GMT
What colour is the back of the stamp and how thick is the paper? Thanks for the quick response, Kelly. Here is a scan of the back of the stamp, such as it is. I did not make any adjustments to either scan to enhance or brighten the colour. I would call the paper colour bluish or grey-blue. This scan makes it look a bit more grey, I think. When I look at it in person, it seems more blue. It is definitely not white, in any case. As for the thickness, I don't really know how to judge such things very well, but I did note that firstfrog2013 commented that one of his NS pence issues was limp. This stamp is not limp. If I hold it near an edge in my tongs, it does not hang down very much at all, so I would qualitatively say that it is relatively stiff. That said, it does not seem particularly thick overall, as when I hold it up to a light source, I can easily and clearly see the design in reverse. So, contradictory as it may sound, the paper seems a bit on the thin side to me, but still shows some stiffness (definitely not limp). I hope that this description helps with, rather than detracts from, coming up with an opinion about this stamp. Thanks!
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Beryllium Guy
Moderator
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What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Feb 8, 2018 16:17:47 GMT
In looking at this stamp from the back, I also just noticed how remarkably straight the tear seems to be. That just strikes me as a bit odd. I don't know if it means anything....
Edit: It makes me wonder if the stamp came off a cover which was folded and straightened a few times, weakening the paper and eventually making it into two pieces.
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 8, 2018 18:42:55 GMT
I agree - the thins and damage would be from the final removal from the envelope. The straight line is intriguing - it would match with a permanent crease in the cover and then when removed, it simply separated. I've had that happen myself (not on a pence issue - if I get those on a corner or a cover, those suckers are there for life!).
Looks like you've got a very well used genuine.
I've noticed within the genuine copies that I own of all 3 recognised colour varieties as well as a few others that used to be listed but are now lumped into the one colour - thickness varies depending on which print it is from.
When I'm on my computer later, I'll add more about the different prints.
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Beryllium Guy
Moderator
Posts: 5,654
What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Feb 8, 2018 19:05:45 GMT
Thanks so much for your insightful comments, Kelly! I will look forward to hearing a bit more later.
It is a real shame that this copy is so badly damaged, as it seems pretty clear that it was, at one time, a true four-margin copy. The good news is that I essentially got it for free. I bought a small collection of early Canada and some Provinces several years ago, and this stamp was included at no charge due to its poor condition.
I hope to get a sound copy of one of these at some point.
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 9, 2018 5:45:07 GMT
Mr. Frog (I think I'll always end up calling you that! 😁) -
You mentioned having greens - pence or cents? The pence green issues are easy to identify - there is quite a difference between the yellow green and dark green. The cents issues are gorgeous with their colour varieties. The yellow green cent issue is beautiful. I noticed you have a nice colour variety on #10. I'm partial to the dark blue.
#12 comes in a gorgeous scarlet vermilion as well.
Of course there are the colour varieties of #9 - the grey purple is nice but the bold purple really pops. Your used bold purple is very nice. If you find an unused copy, it's absolutely breathtaking.
I know, I have a weird obsession with NS issues. I'm the same way with my German states - but more so with the cancellations.
My unusual fascination with Belgian Railways (Parcel Post) unused is based on colour varieties and the used by cancellations to track their destination via private and/or public transit.
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firstfrog2013
Member
Posts: 3,276
What I collect: BNA Liberia St Pierre U.S. Bolivia Turkey
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Post by firstfrog2013 on Feb 9, 2018 23:06:06 GMT
Kelly I found those greens(cents issues) I set them aside to look for elongated earring.I did get a block of nine with the missing shading in the "E" .I'm quite thankful for the distraction of these Nova scotia issues I haven't bought a single large queen in over a week now.
By the way there is no MISTER involved it's just Frog
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 10, 2018 5:00:05 GMT
Lol
You got it Frog 👍😀
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firstfrog2013
Member
Posts: 3,276
What I collect: BNA Liberia St Pierre U.S. Bolivia Turkey
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Post by firstfrog2013 on Feb 10, 2018 14:37:04 GMT
A comparative scan showing poor forgery of the one shilling.Note difference in flowers,crown ect.Forger unknown to me. A scan of backs shows that the 3p is indeed genuine multiple imageKelly are reprints those printed on the white paper?
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 11, 2018 5:03:35 GMT
Yes the reprints are on white paper and they are thicker than genuine. Indeed the blue is genuine. Holding up to a light will give you a fast method to identify awesome forgeries from genuine. You should be able to see a fair amount of the design from the back and the blue paper on margins and back are giveaways.
I have one beautiful forgery that has a blue tint in the margins, flip it over and it's white.
When I get a chance to magnify your shilling forgery, I might be able to identify the forger. I do have 3 that I haven't identified yet of my own. I have an interesting one that was listed as a Sanderson when I bought it and then when I got it, it was a mix. One forger for the stamp and another for the cancellation. Rather interesting and unusual.
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 11, 2018 5:13:48 GMT
What colour did they use to try to pass off the shilling? That is definitely a very poor forgery. I have some in all 3 shilling colours and then some really whacky forgery colours - too bright or the dull purple is pathetic.
I'm still stumped on one of mine. I just can't find the identifying error on it as a forgery. The paper on the genuine shilling is not as noticeably blue like you find on the the 1p and 3p.
Now if only I could identify my Heligoland to see if perchance I've got any genuine ones in that collection. That would make be a happy girl.
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Post by dgdecker on Feb 12, 2018 1:37:54 GMT
Does anyone know if NS plate proofs exist on « thin » paper as opposed to India Paper as indicated in Unitrade 2018 page 696. There is one described as such listed on EBay. The colour may be off because of the photo. Too green for my liking. It might be a colour variation? To me, it looks this may have been a legitimate stamp with perforations trimmed off to make it look like a plate proof. I see this on both sides of imagine. On both front and back views. Any thoughts? any info about plate proofs would be most helpful thanks David
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Post by dgdecker on Feb 12, 2018 2:12:36 GMT
Finally have had the time to figure out how to add images to a post. Below is my newest acquisition that arrived this week. Now that I have this figured out I will post a few images to share with you. David
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Post by dgdecker on Feb 12, 2018 4:07:13 GMT
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 12, 2018 4:45:56 GMT
Does anyone know if NS plate proofs exist on « thin » paper as opposed to India Paper as indicated in Unitrade 2018 page 696. There is one described as such listed on EBay. The colour may be off because of the photo. Too green for my liking. It might be a colour variation? I've never heard of it myself but I've not yet gotten into proofs. If I do, I'll only buy from auction houses such as Eastern. I'd be cautious about proofs and really do a lot of research on them from external sources than catalogues.
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Post by dgdecker on Feb 12, 2018 5:47:56 GMT
I've never heard of it myself but I've not yet gotten into proofs. If I do, I'll only buy from auction houses such as Eastern. I'd be cautious about proofs and really do a lot of research on them from external sources than catalogues. I have a few proofs and none are on thin paper. Citystamp in Montreal has an extensive inventory of proofs for sale and I find none with thin paper. Will have a look at Eastern as that is where I got some of mine. any thoughts as if it might be a « trimmed » stamp? thanks for your input! david
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Poodle_Mum
Member
Inactive
Posts: 252
What I collect: WW to 1950; All German Eras; Imperial Russia & USSR; All Occupations and Colonies of Germany and Russia; Canada; QV and Belgian Railways
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Post by Poodle_Mum on Feb 13, 2018 9:26:24 GMT
If you look closely it's got obvious perfs on all sides - yup, trimmed. I'm thinking a forgery.
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Beryllium Guy
Moderator
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What I collect: Worldwide Stamps 1840-1930
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Post by Beryllium Guy on Feb 13, 2018 14:41:19 GMT
If you look closely it's got obvious perfs on all sides - yup, trimmed. I'm thinking a forgery. Well, David ( dgdecker), not that any further opinions are really needed, but I'm with Kelly on this one: if you look closely at the stamp, you can definitely see the evidence that the stamp was perforated and trimmed. Beyond that, I don't know for sure. The image looks pretty good to me, but the color is certainly off. Could be a changeling? That can occur for a variety of reasons; everything from excessive exposure to sunlight, too much soaking in water, or even deliberate treatment with chemicals that affect the ink. If I had to guess, as the stamp was already trimmed to make it appear imperforate, and that was certainly intentional, I would surmise that the color was also intentionally altered to try to make collectors think that it was a color trial proof or something.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2018 18:08:06 GMT
The "proof" is definitely just a trimmed (possibly altered as BG noted) fake but not a forgery Some many years ago I collected Canadian Provinces and proofs die/color were very inexpensive. Based on major auctions in the US they still sell far below the Unitrade pricing. Anyway I have never seen any listings for other than India paper although some were affixed to card stock. Here are a few 5c from my archives Bluish Green trial color proof Black proof Color proof with slight color variations I have seen this series in perforated proofs but not the 5c
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Post by dgdecker on Feb 13, 2018 18:23:07 GMT
If you look closely it's got obvious perfs on all sides - yup, trimmed. I'm thinking a forgery. Poodlemom, That is what I am thinking. The seller has confirmed that the photo shows it current colour. Says that is due to age and oxidizing. I am ok with that explanation. I cannot find any examples of « thin » paper proofs for sale by any of the established online retailers that I trust. I am glad it’s is not only my eyes that picked up the trimmed perfs. i have asked to seller to advise what catalog was used to establish that this was a plate proof. So far no response. thanks for your help. david
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